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Tue Sep 03, 2013 11:29 am  |
| Rapunzell wrote: |
Having a hard time finding the Sqoom website with info, photos and a price!
Can someone post it? Thanks! |
From Bethany's post, about haflway down page 2:
http://www.sqoom.com/en/
She also says this about galvanic:
| bethany wrote: |
| Fyi that the Sqoom has BOTH galvanic and ultrasound functionality. That means that it can both pull impurities from the skin, and push product for better penetration of actives. |
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302 (Part one): http://www.essentialdayspa.com/forum/viewthread.php?tid=28855&postdays=0&postorder=asc&&start=0 |
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Tue Sep 03, 2013 11:43 am |
| Keliu wrote: |
I'm happy to see you back here too!!
As far as concerns over fat loss - you may be thinking of Ultherapy - this is a type of ultrasound which uses extreme heat to heat the dermis and tighten the skin. I have read of some concerns over fat loss with this, but don't know whether they are really justified or not. One thing seems evident though, results don't seem to be that great - which is why I wonder how these home-use devices can tighten skin. However, I wouldn't be worrying about fat loss with them.
http://www.realself.com/question/new-york-ny-ultherapy-cause-natural-face-volume-loss-from-fat-graft-fillersbut |
I'm flattered that you remember me! 
And yes, that IS what I was thinking of - thank you! And you've been using a "conventional" US for product penetration too, did I read that correctly? A few years ago US devices seemed promising but I don't think any of us had used them long-term at that point. Now we have Karenlee, who's used a Sqoom since 2011, and if you've been using a regular US without any problems, I feel pretty confident about their safety.
In fact, I even might dig out my 2 mhz and remind myself exactly how boring it is to use, and then realistically decide if I could discipline msyelf to use a Merbe or if it would end up collecting dust  |
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302 (Part one): http://www.essentialdayspa.com/forum/viewthread.php?tid=28855&postdays=0&postorder=asc&&start=0 |
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Tue Sep 03, 2013 11:49 am |
OK - here is the next question.
Are we sure that it is actually healthy to push these products this deeply into the skin? As anyone read any research? If so, I would think we'd want them to be 100% natural and healthy.
Look at how many times doctors have told people that this vitamin or that one is safe - only to rescind that later on.
I'm usually pretty quick at buying something - but on this I feel a hesitancy. Also want to hear from Bethany after she's used this for a few weeks. |
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Tue Sep 03, 2013 12:23 pm |
| Rapunzell wrote: |
OK - here is the next question.
Are we sure that it is actually healthy to push these products this deeply into the skin? As anyone read any research? If so, I would think we'd want them to be 100% natural and healthy.
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Rapunzell, this thread is worth a read. Note that it's a few years old now, but the technology has only improved since then...
Edited to add: I'm interested in seeing Beth's results too. With Karenlee and Keliu's feedback, I don't have safety concerns anymore. The only thing holding me back at this point is the cost of the Sqoom gels, and the difficulty of finding an equivalent LMW HA gel. |
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302 (Part one): http://www.essentialdayspa.com/forum/viewthread.php?tid=28855&postdays=0&postorder=asc&&start=0 |
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Tue Sep 03, 2013 12:33 pm |
I will definitely continue to weigh in, and will also keep everyone updated if we learn more about the gel situation.
To Rapunzell's point, I do agree that any actives that are pushed in need to be free of preservatives, etc. the Environ Ionzyme C-Quence line will be my actives product of choice for that reason, since it was developed to be used with needling, sonophoresis, and iontophoresis. |
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No longer answering PM's due to numerous weird messages. |
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Tue Sep 03, 2013 12:58 pm |
| bethany wrote: |
I will definitely continue to weigh in, and will also keep everyone updated if we learn more about the gel situation.
To Rapunzell's point, I do agree that any actives that are pushed in need to be free of preservatives, etc. the Environ Ionzyme C-Quence line will be my actives product of choice for that reason, since it was developed to be used with needling, sonophoresis, and iontophoresis. |
why dont companies list their product's ingredients on their websites?? It's really annoying. I wanted to check how they are preserving the Environ Ionzyme C-Quence... |
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Tue Sep 03, 2013 2:29 pm |
Rapunzell - I sent you some non-Sqoom related PM's.
Regarding the HA you mentioned above, it is not LMW as is used in the Sqoom gels. The devil is in the details with this kind of thing! |
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No longer answering PM's due to numerous weird messages. |
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Tue Sep 03, 2013 4:18 pm |
| karenlee wrote: |
| daler wrote: |
| I read either somewhere on eds or on some other site that ultrasound devcies help break up scar tissue, any comments on it? Thanks |
You may have read my ancedote (see the link posted on the first page of this thread) where I cured my husbands extremely painful shin splint in 3 days, using the Sqoom with the medical gel. |
Thank you karenlee. Also, I was wondering whether yu have used sqoom gel on it's own without the sqoom device? Just wondering if it would penetrate just as well or almost as well. I have read that skin is quite permeable and cosmetic companies have created a myth that it's hard for actives to go inside without some help. TIA for any feedback. |
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Tue Sep 03, 2013 5:01 pm |
| daler wrote: |
| Thank you karenlee. Also, I was wondering whether yu have used sqoom gel on it's own without the sqoom device? Just wondering if it would penetrate just as well or almost as well. I have read that skin is quite permeable and cosmetic companies have created a myth that it's hard for actives to go inside without some help. TIA for any feedback. |
Daler, just an FYI that a whole chapter in Dr. Thornfeldt's book was dedicated to topical delivery, and frankly it was darn confusing with a bunch of formulas. The skin barrier is designed to keep things OUT, and my takeaway was if it was that easy to penetrate it, he wouldn't have allocated a whole chapter to the topic.  |
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No longer answering PM's due to numerous weird messages. |
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Tue Sep 03, 2013 5:16 pm |
| bethany wrote: |
| daler wrote: |
| Thank you karenlee. Also, I was wondering whether yu have used sqoom gel on it's own without the sqoom device? Just wondering if it would penetrate just as well or almost as well. I have read that skin is quite permeable and cosmetic companies have created a myth that it's hard for actives to go inside without some help. TIA for any feedback. |
Daler, just an FYI that a whole chapter in Dr. Thornfeldt's book was dedicated to topical delivery, and frankly it was darn confusing with a bunch of formulas. The skin barrier is designed to keep things OUT, and my takeaway was if it was that easy to penetrate it, he wouldn't have allocated a whole chapter to the topic. |
I woke up today with some allergic red spots on my skin, I used hydrocortisone cream, and within an hour the allergy was gone... n this cream does not contain any liposomes/nanasomes n i didnt used any US either... I am not sure but i think that this allergy must have gone deep down to the dermis as it was quite raised n in order to get rid of it the cortisone would have had to penetrate the dermis, at least that's my understanding.... what do you think? |
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Tue Sep 03, 2013 5:25 pm |
| Lowbrowscientist wrote: |
| The only thing holding me back at this point is the cost of the Sqoom gels, and the difficulty of finding an equivalent LMW HA gel. |
What about this?
100% PURE Hyaluronic Acid Serum - Nature's Moisturizer - Low Malecular Weight -Organically Preserved - No Toxic Chemicals - by High Altitude Organics - 2 fl oz 60 ml
http://www.amazon.com/100-PURE-Hyaluronic-Acid-Serum/dp/B005B6OIG0/ref=aag_m_pw_dp?ie=UTF8&m=A1FN3PMI7TWAR8 |
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Born 1950. There's a new cream on the market that gets rid of wrinkles - you smear it on the mirror!! |
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Tue Sep 03, 2013 5:47 pm |
| daler wrote: |
| bethany wrote: |
| daler wrote: |
| Thank you karenlee. Also, I was wondering whether yu have used sqoom gel on it's own without the sqoom device? Just wondering if it would penetrate just as well or almost as well. I have read that skin is quite permeable and cosmetic companies have created a myth that it's hard for actives to go inside without some help. TIA for any feedback. |
Daler, just an FYI that a whole chapter in Dr. Thornfeldt's book was dedicated to topical delivery, and frankly it was darn confusing with a bunch of formulas. The skin barrier is designed to keep things OUT, and my takeaway was if it was that easy to penetrate it, he wouldn't have allocated a whole chapter to the topic. |
I woke up today with some allergic red spots on my skin, I used hydrocortisone cream, and within an hour the allergy was gone... n this cream does not contain any liposomes/nanasomes n i didnt used any US either... I am not sure but i think that this allergy must have gone deep down to the dermis as it was quite raised n in order to get rid of it the cortisone would have had to penetrate the dermis, at least that's my understanding.... what do you think? |
this article has some very good info related to penetration of the skin barrier.
http://ptjournal.apta.org/content/75/6/539.full.pdf |
_________________
No longer answering PM's due to numerous weird messages. |
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Tue Sep 03, 2013 6:10 pm |
| bethany wrote: |
| daler wrote: |
| bethany wrote: |
| daler wrote: |
| Thank you karenlee. Also, I was wondering whether yu have used sqoom gel on it's own without the sqoom device? Just wondering if it would penetrate just as well or almost as well. I have read that skin is quite permeable and cosmetic companies have created a myth that it's hard for actives to go inside without some help. TIA for any feedback. |
Daler, just an FYI that a whole chapter in Dr. Thornfeldt's book was dedicated to topical delivery, and frankly it was darn confusing with a bunch of formulas. The skin barrier is designed to keep things OUT, and my takeaway was if it was that easy to penetrate it, he wouldn't have allocated a whole chapter to the topic. |
I woke up today with some allergic red spots on my skin, I used hydrocortisone cream, and within an hour the allergy was gone... n this cream does not contain any liposomes/nanasomes n i didnt used any US either... I am not sure but i think that this allergy must have gone deep down to the dermis as it was quite raised n in order to get rid of it the cortisone would have had to penetrate the dermis, at least that's my understanding.... what do you think? |
That doesn't really have anything to do with the Sqoom, but this article has some very good info related to penetration of the skin barrier.
http://ptjournal.apta.org/content/75/6/539.full.pdf |
This is what prompted me to ask karenlee that question, so yes it had something to do with sqoom & sqoom gels skin permeability. If my $2 cortisone cream can penetrate my skin deep enough why not other cosmetics???
Anyways, following is something from the linked study :
" Unfortunately, some of
the studies that showed increases in
drug diffusion with US were correlated
with damage to the stratum corneum.
This damage was either part of the
pathology designated for treatment
(eg, psoriasis, dermatitis, ulcer)B0 or it
was an outcome of the US treatment itself (eg, either a high-frequency US
outside the therapeutic range [lo-16
MHz for 20 minute~13~.3~ or the use of
a stationary sound head "
However I am sure that home use US are not that powerful to give such an injury. |
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Tue Sep 03, 2013 6:13 pm |
Thanks Keliu! This one looks similar to the Ultra LMW HA from Lotioncrafter.
This is in the description: Our Hyaluronic Acid is of low molecular weight (3000 to 8000 Daltons in size). I think this one is actually TOO low, as this study seems to suggest. (Thanks to CookieD for finding that info)
In the study, the conventional higher MW and (much) lower MW HA didn't give optimal results; it was the 50k Daltons MW that showed a benefit. Thus far, it seems like the various MWs available to consumers are either too high or too low to be a good option with the Sqoom 
But Karenlee said she had good results with some Environ gels, and while they're still on the pricey side, they might be doable. I'm wondering if one could still get good results by mixing, say, an Environ gel with BurnOut's "Skin Fix" aloe gel. The ingredients for the BurnOut product look similar to the ingredients in the Fyola gel, so maybe the SKin Fix can be used to stretch the pricier products?
And anyway, this review has me tempted to try the SLMW from Lotioncrafter (just not with the Sqoom or Merbe):
| Amazon poster wrote: |
| [...] My lips get extremely chapped and dry and I have tried numerous organic lip balms and lip scrubs and nothing seemed to work. One day, my lips were so chapped and peeling they were unbearable. Something told me to put a dab of the seum on my lips and I did. My lips were soft and supple instantly (no kidding)!!!! The dry skin completely disappeared. [...] |
ETA: I don't know why the Skin Fix link isn't working, but here are the ingredients (the product is still on the BurnOut website, but you have to navigate to it manually):
Skin Fix Ingredients: Purified Water,
Organic Aloe Barbadensis Leaf Juice*,
Carboxymethyl Cellulose,
Ascorbyl Palmitate,
Organic Chamomile Extract*,
Organic Calendula Extract*,
Organic White Tea Extract*,
Cucumber Extract, Longevicell,
Mixed Tocopherol,
Phytoplankton,
Ascorbic Acid,
Ethylhexylglycerin.
Fyola gel ingredients: Water (Aqua),
Aloe Barbadensis Leaf Juice (Aloe Vera)
Laminaria Digitata (Seaweed)
Carbomer, Matricaria Recutita (Chamomile Flowers)
Organic Urtica Dioica (Nettle Leaf)
Sambucus Nigra (Elder Flower)
Citrus Aurantium (Orange Peel)
Foeniculum Vulgare (Fennel)
Citrus Paradisi (Grapefruit Pink)
Rosa Mosqueta (Rose Hip Seed Oil)
Panthenol (Vitamin B5)
Allantoin, Tocopheryl Acetate (Vitamin E)
Sodium Salt Glycine (naturally-derived amino acid). |
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302 (Part one): http://www.essentialdayspa.com/forum/viewthread.php?tid=28855&postdays=0&postorder=asc&&start=0 |
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Tue Sep 03, 2013 6:15 pm |
You guys are basically rocket scientists.
When YOU figure it out - I'm doing it! |
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Tue Sep 03, 2013 6:57 pm |
| daler wrote: |
If my $2 cortisone cream can penetrate my skin deep enough why not other cosmetics???
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Great. When you have the Sqoom gel replicated and ready to go, please let us know! |
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No longer answering PM's due to numerous weird messages. |
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Tue Sep 03, 2013 8:15 pm |
| bethany wrote: |
| daler wrote: |
If my $2 cortisone cream can penetrate my skin deep enough why not other cosmetics???
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Great. When you have the Sqoom gel replicated and ready to go, please let us know! |
lol, I dont understand the need for this sarcastic remark. So I cant even wonder why my $2 cortisone cream can penetrate my skin but not other cosmetic actives?
When did I say that I am trying to replicate sqoom's gel? that's you not me.
I asked karenlee if she has used the sqoom gel without the sqoom device and if so how was it's skin penetration and visible results. |
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Tue Sep 03, 2013 11:32 pm |
Hi daler
No, I've not bothered with the gel on its own, probably because it's fairly thick, ie not a runny serum. Also, it leaves a layer on the skin (not in a horrible way, but you feel a 'slip' on your skin when you wash it off in the morning, and if you try to put moisturiser on top, it feels fine for a while but a couple of hours later, your moisturiser will ball up to the touch - which is why, I guess, they say to wash your face before applying cream) |
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Wed Sep 04, 2013 9:34 am |
| karenlee wrote: |
Hi daler
No, I've not bothered with the gel on its own, probably because it's fairly thick, ie not a runny serum. Also, it leaves a layer on the skin (not in a horrible way, but you feel a 'slip' on your skin when you wash it off in the morning, and if you try to put moisturiser on top, it feels fine for a while but a couple of hours later, your moisturiser will ball up to the touch - which is why, I guess, they say to wash your face before applying cream) |
Thank you v much karenlee. |
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Wed Sep 04, 2013 2:11 pm |
| I have found out the ingredient lists for the "Sqoom" products.. I'm not sure if you already have them, so let me know before I wear my fingers to the nub typing. |
_________________
♥I'm flattered by all the lovely PM's, but I don't get here much these days. Please don't be afraid to post your quearies to other DIY members who will be glad to help you (or sell you their wares..lol) Still happy with LED, dermarolling and a DIY antioxidant regime. Peace & Hugs to all.♥ |
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Wed Sep 04, 2013 2:26 pm |
| Please do Kassy! (pouring you a virtual glass of wine in thanks for the trouble) |
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Wed Sep 04, 2013 7:04 pm |
As promised, and thanks 'Lotus', that vino hit the spot... 
Xcential Hya/Gel Ingredients:
Aloe Barbadensis Leaf Juice
Alcohol
Glycerin
Sodium Hyaluronate (doesn't specify molecular wgt.)
Xylitylglucoside
Anhydroxylitol
Lepidium Sativum Sprout Extract
Lecithin
Inula Viscosa Extract
Xylitol
Xanthan Gum
Acrylates C10-30 Alkyl Acrylate Crosspolymer
For the most part, looks like sugar substitutes, humectants, and a Sweedish plant extract or two, disguised as an AOX.
Sqoom DeSpot Ingredients:
Aloe Barbadensis Leaf Juice
Alcohol
Glycerin
Lepidium Sativum Sprout Extract
Sodium Hyaluronate
Soy Isoflavone
Lecithin
Papain
Calcium Pantotenate
Urea
Magnesium Lactate
Potassium Lactate
Serine
Proline
Alanine
Magnesium Chloride
Xanthan Gum,
Sodium Acrylates C10-30 Alkyl Acrylate Crosspolymer
Fruit enzymes + humectants for the most part.
Cleanser Gel Ingredients:
Aloe Vera Leaf Juice
Alcohol
Glycerin
Panthenol
Chamomilla Recutita Extract ( why not just chamomile extract?)
Xanthan Gum
Sodium Acrylates C10-30 Alkyl Acrylate Crosspolymer
Maltodextrin
Silica
Hope that helps! Be sure to give me a shout out, when you want to make something really good to feed your skin  |
_________________
♥I'm flattered by all the lovely PM's, but I don't get here much these days. Please don't be afraid to post your quearies to other DIY members who will be glad to help you (or sell you their wares..lol) Still happy with LED, dermarolling and a DIY antioxidant regime. Peace & Hugs to all.♥ |
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Wed Sep 04, 2013 7:10 pm |
FYI that I have not used the Merbe since Sunday, and the lift in my marionette lines did hold. However, when I used it tonight I did not see any incremental lift.
I saw some significant lift at the beginning (more so than with just the microcurrent), but this is definitely not something that will eliminate them if you are at bloodhound status. It is a minor (but still welcome) change at best.
However, I am still hoping for some longer term improvement with forehead lines over time. |
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No longer answering PM's due to numerous weird messages. |
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