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Sun Jan 26, 2014 7:17 pm  |
| bethany wrote: |
Is ASG patented? That would probably answer a lot of questions.
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Jim has stated previously on this forum that he has no intention of ever patenting his products.
ETA: He has also revealed that he, alone, manufacturers every bottle and that other scientists would not be able to replicate the process. |
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Born 1950. There's a new cream on the market that gets rid of wrinkles - you smear it on the mirror!! |
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Sun Jan 26, 2014 7:45 pm |
| Keliu wrote: |
| bethany wrote: |
Is ASG patented? That would probably answer a lot of questions.
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Jim has stated previously on this forum that he has no intention of ever patenting his products.
ETA: He has also revealed that he, alone, manufacturers every bottle and that other scientists would not be able to replicate the process. |
BREAKING NEWS!!! Water cannot be patented... |
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Sun Jan 26, 2014 7:57 pm |
| if I remember correctly, Jim had mentioned here on EDS that ASG needs to be in glass bottles either blue or amber ( forgot which one) or the " energy " in ASG would be destroyed during shipping scans , but these bottles appear to be plastic bottles, no? |
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Sun Jan 26, 2014 8:09 pm |
| daler wrote: |
| if I remember correctly, Jim had mentioned here on EDS that ASG needs to be in glass bottles either blue or amber ( forgot which one) or the " energy " in ASG would be destroyed during shipping scans , but these bottles appear to be plastic bottles, no? |
No, he states that wrapping the bottle in large bubble wrap protects the product from x-rays!! |
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Born 1950. There's a new cream on the market that gets rid of wrinkles - you smear it on the mirror!! |
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Sun Jan 26, 2014 8:12 pm |
| Keliu wrote: |
| daler wrote: |
| if I remember correctly, Jim had mentioned here on EDS that ASG needs to be in glass bottles either blue or amber ( forgot which one) or the " energy " in ASG would be destroyed during shipping scans , but these bottles appear to be plastic bottles, no? |
No, he states that wrapping the bottle in large bubble wrap protects the product from x-rays!! |
Oh! I wonder why I get to be wrapped up in lead when X-rayed-- silly medical professionals, they need to get me some bubble wrap... |
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Sun Jan 26, 2014 8:20 pm |
| daler wrote: |
| if I remember correctly, Jim had mentioned here on EDS that ASG needs to be in glass bottles either blue or amber ( forgot which one) or the " energy " in ASG would be destroyed during shipping scans , but these bottles appear to be plastic bottles, no? |
They show these same plastic bottles (looks like there is a glass bottle, too) on this promotional video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dnFcBkWdZsY
Perhaps Jim changed his mind about the product having to be in glass bottles?  |
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Photo taken Oct 28, 2013: http://bit.ly/17Umeou |
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Sun Jan 26, 2014 9:06 pm |
I think at the end of the day we are all going to have to agree to disagree on this product.
Some people buy things based on scientific explanations, some buy based on independent clinicals, some buy based on marketing hype, some buy based on feelings, some buy based on what friends say, etc.
But as long as everyone is fully informed as to where a product fits (meaning one or more of those categories), so be it. |
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No longer answering PM's due to numerous weird messages. |
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Sun Jan 26, 2014 10:01 pm |
| Keliu wrote: |
| daler wrote: |
| if I remember correctly, Jim had mentioned here on EDS that ASG needs to be in glass bottles either blue or amber ( forgot which one) or the " energy " in ASG would be destroyed during shipping scans , but these bottles appear to be plastic bottles, no? |
No, he states that wrapping the bottle in large bubble wrap protects the product from x-rays!! |
hilarious!! |
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47 years old. Battling aging and pigmentation. Using Tria and Pico and Dermapen. |
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Mon Jan 27, 2014 6:20 am |
| Since this thread has been taken over by the Ageless Secret naysayers... I have an idea - Why don't you ladies open up your own "Science of Ageless" thread? It seems to be a topic that you just can't wrap your brains around. You could all do your own independent research and report back. Nothing more to say... |
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Mon Jan 27, 2014 6:59 am |
| aprile wrote: |
| Since this thread has been taken over by the Ageless Secret naysayers... I have an idea - Why don't you ladies open up your own "Science of Ageless" thread? It seems to be a topic that you just can't wrap your brains around. You could all do your own independent research and report back. Nothing more to say... |
That's the trouble, there's no science to discuss.
Aprile, I know you're familiar with this quote from the ASG website:
| Quote: |
.. children under the age of 12 can hold a glass of water with both hands and their Life Force is so powerful it can pass through the glass into the water making the water taste very soft and smooth. So every time children drink water their Life Force changes it to this powerful water that deeply hydrates them better than plain water,..."
http://agelesssecret.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=73&Itemid=166 |
You've stated that you've tried this out on your young son and the water he "energised" made your skin soft and smooth. So I'm wondering why you are still purchasing ASG or using magnets on your water when you have this very handy method of "energising" water at your disposal. |
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Born 1950. There's a new cream on the market that gets rid of wrinkles - you smear it on the mirror!! |
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Mon Jan 27, 2014 7:21 am |
Because Keliu my son is not under 12; he's 16. I did the experiment while ago with my niece and nephew who are both under 10. At the time I did it, I even tested my sister in law who is in her late 30's. If memory serves me correct my son was around 13... According to Jim there is no set in stone exact age when you can no longer energize water, but despite that - the water doesn't remain energized forever in the glass. So what should I do take my son out of school and bring him to work with me? No matter, you don't believe in the science anyway.
You used Ageelss Keliu and you said it did nothing for you. Did you finish the last bit of your supply? If not, why don't you do the wine or coffee test for yourself and see if you notice a difference? Of course, you would have to be blindfolded and do it with your husband so that you wouldn't know which glass had been energized. Honestly, the wine and the coffee DOES become less bitter tasting - more smooth. OR why not have one of your grandchildren or another child do the experiment? OR is your mind not open enough to try that? That's the problem here.
We who are posting here about energetic products on this thread ARE open to learning about new things. Those who are making jokes and discounting all of our posts are in another camp and that's fine. BUT, if people aren't open to learning, reading about these things, then WHY frequent this thread? As such, I akin these posts to bullying, which is extremely immature. OF course, we are defending our views. Suffice it to say, this thread will eventually be taken down, which really does makes this appear to be an *Agenda Driven Issue* here at EDS. Obviously ALL of you are not interested in learning more about these things we are discussing so WHY is it you continue to post snarky, condescending posts? I just don't get it.  |
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Mon Jan 27, 2014 8:44 am |
There does appear to be an agenda on the part of the naysayers. I haven't been able to figure out why, unless it really is just bullying.
I was traveling over Christmas reading some of the ASG information. I was actually get mad at the absurdity of it. I kept thinking, "this guy is selling water for $99 a bottle, and people are buying it!" This is the biggest hoax ever. The thing I couldn't get past though, was the fact that there were long time EDSers that loved it. I have watched those same people search for years for something that worked. Those same people have tested product after product saying this didn't work for me, that one did, or this one didn't work well enough to justify the time and/$. Those were the same people whose product suggestions almost always work for me. This product worked for them and they were willing to endure all the rude comments to let people know it. So, I decided to order a sample just to prove to myself that it really was a bunch of crap and these people were all nuts. I took the bottle out of the box and sprayed it on one hand and not the other. After a short time, I told myself that the difference I was seeing couldn't possibly be right. My left hand feeling smoother had to be that it needed to dry some more. As the day went on, it got smoother. I even decided at one point that my fingertips had to be rougher on one hand than the other since the ASG hand felt so much smoother. I was almost annoyed that it worked. So, I started using it on my face. Over the next few weeks, my skin improved. Blackheads that I have struggled with since I was a teenager diminished.
Trust me, I know the science sounds more like the rantings of a nutcase, but it works for me. Science or no science, it works for me! If you don't like it, don't buy it, but why do you care so much if I do? |
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I always lie about my age. I tell everyone I'm 10 years older than I really am. Everyone thinks I look great! |
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Mon Jan 27, 2014 8:50 am |
| Oh, and even when I was reading all of the information wondering if these people were nuts, I had enough respect for them as human beings to not go on the forum and berate them. |
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I always lie about my age. I tell everyone I'm 10 years older than I really am. Everyone thinks I look great! |
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Mon Jan 27, 2014 9:47 am |
| Tonia wrote: |
| Oh, and even when I was reading all of the information wondering if these people were nuts, I had enough respect for them as human beings to not go on the forum and berate them. |
The best way to let this die down is to NOT respond at all to the naysayers. When there is no reaction, there is nothing to push against, and the energy behind one's "position" has to dissipate.
We could go on having conversations about whatever and just jump over the Ageless naysayers.
They get fueled by the reactions. |
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Mon Jan 27, 2014 10:03 am |
Tonia,
I don't think anybody doubts your claims that ASG works for you, i am sure in general everybody is happy for you. If you see benefits big enough to justify the purchase, great, it is your money.
What I am against and strongly disagree is talking on the same day about ASG and science. As long as it is called miracle and belief, I am with you. A child younger that 12 passing energy to water glass? With all due respect, let's call the things as they are and not mix them.
Most of the opponents here are (as I see it) calling for the same, keep observations factual and without trying to create science behind something that is not even a close to it.
For what i hear from your experience, ASG probably contains more that water, whatever it is it seems to make your skin soft. Fine, great, but it is not water and certainly not the hidden energy in the water. I wish that could be done, can you imagine what it would do to the electricity price? Marvelous thing, it will become so cheap that we can light the whole globe!
What comes to H2O2 and O3, both of them are toxic (yes, depends on the dosing). Arsenic is used as a medicine too, in very microdoses, so probably peroxide and ozone do something to the body. We should still remember, that at the same time they do harm somewhere else in the same body. So as long as everybody understands that there is price to pay for drinking peroxide and breathing ozone,it is fair.
Being fully aware that I will be viciosly attacked for my next comment, I still need to make it.
Aprile, your comments about cancer sound like you consider it as one disease. Your comments give the impression that information you posses about various available therapies that is at least two decades old. A little update on latest advancements in various cancer therapies may do good.
Please, no need to get upset or offended on comments claiming lack of science in most of the explanations posted here, simply because the science isn't there.
Water being made wetter to brake the surface tension? Again, as long as this sentence is not presented with a scientific argument, it is fine with me, but just respect our intelligence and try not to dress nonsense with scientific terms.
Sharing of experience is wonderful, torturing physics and chemistry is rediculous the least.
Respectfully,
Light (engineer's brain almost went into shock reading about energised water, but well into recovery now) |
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52 years, sagging sucks |
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Mon Jan 27, 2014 10:16 am |
| aprile wrote: |
Because Keliu my son is not under 12; he's 16. I did the experiment while ago with my niece and nephew who are both under 10. At the time I did it, I even tested my sister in law who is in her late 30's. If memory serves me correct my son was around 13... According to Jim there is no set in stone exact age when you can no longer energize water, but despite that - the water doesn't remain energized forever in the glass. So what should I do take my son out of school and bring him to work with me? No matter, you don't believe in the science anyway.
You used Ageelss Keliu and you said it did nothing for you. Did you finish the last bit of your supply? If not, why don't you do the wine or coffee test for yourself and see if you notice a difference? Of course, you would have to be blindfolded and do it with your husband so that you wouldn't know which glass had been energized. Honestly, the wine and the coffee DOES become less bitter tasting - more smooth. OR why not have one of your grandchildren or another child do the experiment? OR is your mind not open enough to try that? That's the problem here.
We who are posting here about energetic products on this thread ARE open to learning about new things. Those who are making jokes and discounting all of our posts are in another camp and that's fine. BUT, if people aren't open to learning, reading about these things, then WHY frequent this thread? As such, I akin these posts to bullying, which is extremely immature. OF course, we are defending our views. Suffice it to say, this thread will eventually be taken down, which really does makes this appear to be an *Agenda Driven Issue* here at EDS. Obviously ALL of you are not interested in learning more about these things we are discussing so WHY is it you continue to post snarky, condescending posts? I just don't get it. |
Why would you have to use a child under 12? You can "energize" your own water for free
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GXGfIdegM3I
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAlL7vXkQBU
Anybody ever heard of the "placebo effect"?
http://science.howstuffworks.com/life/placebo-effect.htm
This product is something that is touted as a "breakthrough in anti aging" but it hasn't "anti aged" anyone, including its creator. (Some people claim that their skin is soft, that's the whole of it) It can't be patented, either. And then you wonder why we don't want readers bamboozled by this stuff without the reality at least being presented?? |
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Photo taken Oct 28, 2013: http://bit.ly/17Umeou |
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Mon Jan 27, 2014 10:30 am |
| aprile wrote: |
| Since this thread has been taken over by the Ageless Secret naysayers... I have an idea - Why don't you ladies open up your own "Science of Ageless" thread? It seems to be a topic that you just can't wrap your brains around. You could all do your own independent research and report back. Nothing more to say... |
Aprile, I am sure you remember the "Science of Copper Peptides" thread that was specifically opened to discuss studies, etc. The ardent CP supporters (who had no studies or science to contribute) could NOT stay away...some of which are major contributors on this very thread. So while it sounds like a great theory, time has proven that neither side respects the requested boundaries.
| Tonia wrote: |
| There does appear to be an agenda on the part of the naysayers. I haven't been able to figure out why, unless it really is just bullying. |
I have discussed this topic with a number of other EDS members, and the need to share information falls into these buckets:
1. When EDS deletes threads (as happened with the old ASG thread), lots of valuable input from members is no longer available to newbies for research purposes (though many refuse to read more than 3 pages anyway, lol). Some of the EDS members just want to make sure that new members (or lurkers) are hearing both sides of the stories before they part with a significant amount of money for a product that has not worked for some people (but has worked for others).
2. EDS used to be well known for their detailed approach to finding the best actives that are proven to perform...changing that mindset takes time, and it is hard for analytical mindsets to suddenly change to just accepting what people tell them instead of trying to prove it to themselves.
3. We have members on this very thread who publically "outed" people that they felt were representing a vendor to push product sales (remember 302?), yet now we have those same people representing vendors themselves and EDS. You reap what you sow in this instance...what is good for the goose is good for the gander, right?
Basically, these threads are DISCUSSION threads....they are not "product rave" threads. So hopefully everyone can find a way to peacefully co-exist as EDS originally intended.
| Tonia wrote: |
| Oh, and even when I was reading all of the information wondering if these people were nuts, I had enough respect for them as human beings to not go on the forum and berate them. |
Tonia, unfortunately some of the same people focused on positive energy have previously berated other members (calling them names, stupid, etc) for NOT using certain products. So we have lots of people in glass houses here, though you may not have seen it all first hand. |
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No longer answering PM's due to numerous weird messages. |
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Mon Jan 27, 2014 10:31 am |
If the product is based on what comes across as junk science, why not just market it that way? instead of pushing the junk science?
It could instead be marketed like "it works, we don't know why, but it does, just look at all of these wonderful anecdotal reports and before and after photos"?
Give out lots of free samples so people can see for themselves - if it truly can't be explained using the conventional scientific methods, then let the people decide....
where are the samples?
thanks, BFg |
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Not Affiliated with any products or gadgets, encourage other posters here to state their affiliations in their signature line |
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Mon Jan 27, 2014 11:27 am |
Barefootgirl,
last time i looked at the ASG site (a few months ago)Jim was still offering a full money back guarantee if anyone wasn't satisfied with ASG...
not exactly a free sample...but much much much better than most skincare product company's refund offers...
so... if that policy is still in effect (check the Ageless Secret website) noone needs to fear losing their money if they don't experience benefit from ASG. |
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Mon Jan 27, 2014 12:08 pm |
Except that trying to get a refund is like pulling teeth.
I have tried the product, it did not work and I did not get a refund. 
Lesson learned. And so with many products and gadgets.
I have had info and data pushed down my throat when I disagree with an "expert" here many times in the past.
Got it, I don't care how "smart" you are or if you are an expert in your field. If a product works or doesn't work for me, I say so PERIOD. And that should be enough.
That's all we are going for here.
No agenda, politics or special interests, just pure honesty (which should be respected).
That's what this forum used to be and what we need to get it back to. There shouldn't be a place here for anything less. |
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Joined the 50 club several years back, blonde w/ fair/sensitive skin, Texas humidity and prone to rosacea, light breakouts and sunburns, combo skin type, starting to see sundamage and fine lines |
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Mon Jan 27, 2014 12:28 pm |
"Money back guarantees" are not even close to being the same thing as free samples.
1. The majority of people, if they don't like something, simply stop using it. Many people will not go through the trouble to try to get their money back. Why, you might ask?
2. Trying to get one's money back on a "guarantee" is often not as easy as it sounds. Some companies make the process relatively simple and painless while others make the process extremely difficult and even impossible, in some cases. Anyone who's tried to get their money back on a "money back guarantee" is well aware of the headaches that causes in many cases and many believe it's not worth the time or trouble to even try. Therefore, most products that have a "money back guarantee" have a very small percentage of people attempting to get their money back; regardless of whether the product is any good or not.
I agree with Barefootgirl. Why not give out free samples and let people try it for themselves? What's the harm in that, if the product "works" for some people?
I suspect that the high price tag and no samples is a 'marketing ploy' of sorts. It's a very well known fact in marketing that the higher the price of a product, the higher the perceived quality of that product is. Selling water with a few trace amounts of minerals in it for almost $100 will certainly get many people to perceive that water as being "high quality":
http://surface.syr.edu/busad_etd/78/
If Jim Kaszyk truly believed his product "worked" for the majority of people who tried it, he would have nothing to lose by offering free samples and getting thousands more people interested in the product.
Why isn't ASG available on Amazon? Apparently it was for a short time:
http://www.amazon.com/Ageless-Secret-Gold/dp/B0088EV9MS/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top
If you can buy ASG here or buy ASG from the website or buy it at an "Anti Aging Conference", why not Amazon? I'll tell you why: Amazon has bona fide reviews from real people, good and bad. And those reviews are almost always at the top of a Google Search when looking for a product; especially when plugging in "XXXX Product Reviews". Jim Kaszyk knows exactly what would happen if ASG were available for purchase and review on Amazon. He'd get plenty of reviews from people saying it did absolutely nothing for them at all and probably quite a few reviews questioning the alleged "science" behind the product. Think about that for a while. |
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Photo taken Oct 28, 2013: http://bit.ly/17Umeou |
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Mon Jan 27, 2014 12:29 pm |
| AnnieR wrote: |
Except that trying to get a refund is like pulling teeth.
I have tried the product, it did not work and I did not get a refund.
Lesson learned. And so with many products and gadgets.
I have had info and data pushed down my throat when I disagree with an "expert" here many times in the past.
Got it, I don't care how "smart" you are or if you are an expert in your field. If a product works or doesn't work for me, I say so PERIOD. And that should be enough.
That's all we are going for here.
No agenda, politics or special interests, just pure honesty (which should be respected).
That's what this forum used to be and what we need to get it back to. There shouldn't be a place here for anything less. |
Exactly. |
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Photo taken Oct 28, 2013: http://bit.ly/17Umeou |
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Mon Jan 27, 2014 1:06 pm |
Money back guarantee (when it is done properly) works for things that one needs to use for a while before seeing the results.
But according to you guys, Tonia, Mariposa, the results are immediate, in the next 2 sec (for the wine) or 24 hours (for the skin).
So a miniature sample size sounds like a great deal, very cost effective way to convince half of the world population at least.
Light |
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52 years, sagging sucks |
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Mon Jan 27, 2014 1:12 pm |
Would it be possible for all the wonderful ladies who are willing to spend countless hours and effort to enlighten the rest of us to the advantages and disadvantages of ASG to create a separate ASG thread and move all ASG pertaining discussions there?
This thread is NOT dedicated to ASG.
While it is unclear what is more offensive pushing pseudo-science or incessant pontification would it not be great if both had finally stopped?
There are a few of us here who are actually trying to share our knowledge and experience, and are considering ourselves quite capable of having critical judgement to make decision for OURSELVES whether we want or not the given product or technology.
It also would be most beneficial to avoid strict categorization: while there is a lot of research being done by people with Ph.D. and M.D.s after their names regarding ozone and it's applications it does not seem too credible to have it categorically declared as poison on a skin care forum. Considering that scientists are still unclear about climate warming (most think yes, but I recently read an article by the Japanese scientist and another one by the Russian scientist, who actually think the opposite is true - go figure) it would be seem most beneficial to make allowance for the benefit of the doubt.
Please, try to have at least a iota of consideration for the rest of the community here! |
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Early 50s, Skin: combin.,semi-sensitive, fair with occasional breakouts, some old acne scars, freckles, under-eye wrinkles; Redhead with hazel eyes |
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Mon Jan 27, 2014 1:13 pm |
| AngelaE8654 wrote: |
| AnnieR wrote: |
Except that trying to get a refund is like pulling teeth.
I have tried the product, it did not work and I did not get a refund.
Lesson learned. And so with many products and gadgets.
I have had info and data pushed down my throat when I disagree with an "expert" here many times in the past.
Got it, I don't care how "smart" you are or if you are an expert in your field. If a product works or doesn't work for me, I say so PERIOD. And that should be enough.
That's all we are going for here.
No agenda, politics or special interests, just pure honesty (which should be respected).
That's what this forum used to be and what we need to get it back to. There shouldn't be a place here for anything less. |
Exactly. |
Annie, next time in cases like these, contact your credit card co., u ll need to show em the money back grantee proof n they would get your money back; there is a time limit, i think within 3 months of a purchase... |
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