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Sun Jan 02, 2011 5:13 pm  |
Found this very interesting especially for those with sensitive skin!
Topical ascorbic acid on photoaged skin. Clinical, topographical and ultrastructural evaluation: double-blind study vs. placebo.
Humbert PG, Haftek M, Creidi P, Lapière C, Nusgens B, Richard A, Schmitt D, Rougier A, Zahouani H.
Department of Dermatology, Hospital Saint Jacques, University of Franche-Comté, Besançon, France.
Abstract
Vitamin C is known for its antioxidant potential and activity in the collagen biosynthetic pathway. Photoprotective properties of topically applied vitamin C have also been demonstrated, placing this molecule as a potential candidate for use in the prevention and treatment of skin ageing. A topically applied cream containing 5% vitamin C and its excipient were tested on healthy female volunteers presenting with photoaged skin on their low-neck and arms in view to evaluate efficacy and safety of such treatment. A double-blind, randomized trial was performed over a 6-month period, comparing the action of the vitamin C cream vs. excipient on photoaged skin. Clinical assessments included evaluation at the beginning and after 3 and 6 months of daily treatment. They were performed by the investigator and compared with the volunteer self assessment. Skin relief parameters were determined on silicone rubber replicas performed at the same time-points. Cutaneous biopsies were obtained at the end of the trial and investigated using immunohistochemistry and electron microscopy. Clinical examination by a dermatologist as well as self-assessment by the volunteers disclosed a significant improvement, in terms of the 'global score', on the vitamin C-treated side compared with the control. A highly significant increase in the density of skin microrelief and a decrease of the deep furrows were demonstrated. Ultrastructural evidence of the elastic tissue repair was also obtained and well corroborated the favorable results of the clinical and skin surface examinations. Topical application of 5% vitamin C cream was an effective and well-tolerated treatment. It led to a clinically apparent improvement of the photodamaged skin and induced modifications of skin relief and ultrastructure, suggesting a positive influence of topical vitamin C on parameters characteristic for sun-induced skin ageing.
Topical ascorbic acid on photoaged skin. Clinical,... [Exp Dermatol. 2003] - PubMed |
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I'LL SEE YOU ON THE DARKSIDE OF THE MOON.... |
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Sun Jan 02, 2011 6:49 pm |
Philippe G. Humbert (1), Marek Haftek (2), Pierre Creidi (1), Charles Lapière (3), Betty Nusgens (3), Alain Richard (4), Daniel Schmitt (2), André Rougier (4), Hassan Zahouani (5)
Author Information:
1 Department of Dermatology, Hospital Saint Jacques, University of Franche-Comté, Besançon, France.
2 INSERM U.346/CNRS, ‘Peau humaine et Immunité’, E. Herriot Hospital, Lyon, France.
3 Laboratory of Connective Tissues Biology, Tour de Pathology, University of Liège, Sart Tilman, Belgium.
4 La Roche Posay Pharmaceutical Laboratories, Asnières, France.
5 The Laboratoire de Tribologie et Dynamique des Systèmes, UMR CNRS 5513, Ecole Centrale de Lyon, Ecully, France.
La Roche Posay does make Vitamin C products containing 5% ascorbic acid. |
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Born 1953; Blonde-Blue; Normal skin |
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Sun Jan 02, 2011 7:10 pm |
Yes Lacy, As we see quite often the majority of studies that are done on most skin care products are paid for by companies that are selling a product containing that ingredient???
It's worth a shot for those that DIY to try a lower percentage if they already have the ingredients, who knows maybe it will work and be tolerable? |
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I'LL SEE YOU ON THE DARKSIDE OF THE MOON.... |
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Sun Jan 02, 2011 7:17 pm |
This is great info, thanks DM.
I could not tolerate LAA at even 10%. No burning or dryness.. but over time I figured out that LAA was the culprit that made my skin chronically red.
I'll might just give it a try at 5% and see if it works better. I want it to work  |
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42! Currently using: NCN All-in-One, Mito-Q cream, Eviron AVST, Osea, Grateful Body. Wouldnt be without: Rhassoul clay, avocado oil, Glorybe Herbals hydrosols and perfume oils |
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Sun Jan 02, 2011 7:23 pm |
| erg wrote: |
This is great info, thanks DM.
I could not tolerate LAA at even 10%. No burning or dryness.. but over time I figured out that LAA was the culprit that made my skin chronically red.
I'll might just give it a try at 5% and see if it works better. I want it to work |
Good luck erg,
I know you aren't alone having problems with the higher percentages. At least they tested on real people and not hairless mice. 
I hope it works for you and others. |
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I'LL SEE YOU ON THE DARKSIDE OF THE MOON.... |
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Mon Jan 03, 2011 1:17 am |
I can't seem to go past 10% after all these years.
I have the Neostrata 10% vitamin C and can only use that 2 or 3 times a week at most..and not even every week, and still find my skin is not used to it.
I bought the Neostrata 20% a while ago when it was on sale and that is way too strong and can only use that once a week.
-the product, luckily is in a airless pump...but has been sitting there for a couple months not being used..maybe I'll try it on my elbows? |
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Mon Jan 03, 2011 1:19 am |
| Lacy53 wrote: |
Philippe G. Humbert (1), Marek Haftek (2), Pierre Creidi (1), Charles Lapière (3), Betty Nusgens (3), Alain Richard (4), Daniel Schmitt (2), André Rougier (4), Hassan Zahouani (5)
Author Information:
1 Department of Dermatology, Hospital Saint Jacques, University of Franche-Comté, Besançon, France.
2 INSERM U.346/CNRS, ‘Peau humaine et Immunité’, E. Herriot Hospital, Lyon, France.
3 Laboratory of Connective Tissues
Biology, Tour de Pathology, University of Liège, Sart Tilman, Belgium.
4 La Roche Posay Pharmaceutical Laboratories, Asnières, France.
5 The Laboratoire de Tribologie et
Dynamique des Systèmes, UMR CNRS 5513, Ecole Centrale de Lyon, Ecully, France.
La Roche Posay does make Vitamin C products
containing 5% ascorbic acid. |
Sorry Lacy,
I meant to say thank you for posting the authors ect. I wouldn't want any copyright issues! The darn iPhone, I thought I had copied everything, but I guess I managed to exclude that information. |
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I'LL SEE YOU ON THE DARKSIDE OF THE MOON.... |
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Mon Jan 03, 2011 5:48 am |
Before using Retin-A, I could apply 15% Vit C serum on my skin every morning; sometimes up to twice a day.
When I started the regime of Retin-A one & half year ago, I had to stop the seum as it burned my skin like no tomorrow and my face turned as red as chilly.
Now, I could still feel tingling and a bit burning sensation even I drop it to 10%. |
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Mon Jan 03, 2011 10:27 am |
| summer2004 wrote: |
Before using Retin-A, I could apply 15% Vit C serum on my skin every morning; sometimes up to twice a day.
When I started the regime of Retin-A one & half year ago, I had to stop the seum as it burned my skin like no tomorrow and my face turned as red as chilly.
Now, I could still feel tingling and a bit burning sensation even I drop it to 10%. |
Summer,
I don't think this will work for everyone, but they are using 5% with results in the study which is half the strength of what the lowest percentage you were using? That could possibly make a huge difference. |
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I'LL SEE YOU ON THE DARKSIDE OF THE MOON.... |
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Mon Jan 03, 2011 12:03 pm |
| DarkMoon wrote: |
| Lacy53 wrote: |
Philippe G. Humbert (1), Marek Haftek (2), Pierre Creidi (1), Charles Lapière (3), Betty Nusgens (3), Alain Richard (4), Daniel Schmitt (2), André Rougier (4), Hassan Zahouani (5)
Author Information:
1 Department of Dermatology, Hospital Saint Jacques, University of Franche-Comté, Besançon, France.
2 INSERM U.346/CNRS, ‘Peau humaine et Immunité’, E. Herriot Hospital, Lyon, France.
3 Laboratory of Connective Tissues
Biology, Tour de Pathology, University of Liège, Sart Tilman, Belgium.
4 La Roche Posay Pharmaceutical Laboratories, Asnières, France.
5 The Laboratoire de Tribologie et
Dynamique des Systèmes, UMR CNRS 5513, Ecole Centrale de Lyon, Ecully, France.
La Roche Posay does make Vitamin C products
containing 5% ascorbic acid. |
Sorry Lacy,
I meant to say thank you for posting the authors ect. I wouldn't want any copyright issues! The darn iPhone, I thought I had copied everything, but I guess I managed to exclude that information. |
Actually you did copy everything DarkMoon, assuming you found the article at PubMed; your phone is working just fine. I just happened to recognize the study as La Roche Posay's, so I searched elsewhere for author information. I also found this study for anyone interested in 5% L-AA (also done by LRP):
http://www.nature.com/jid/journal/v116/n6/full/5601085a.html
That study actually addresses the question you asked elsewhere ... why only 60% of people seem to respond to topical application of L-AA. The authors state It is worth noting that the testers that have the lowest score of dietary vitamin C intake are those in which topically applied vitamin C displayed the most constant stimulation of the steady-state level of mRNA for collagens and their processing enzymes. Further down the article they suggest that:
Nevertheless, our data demonstrate that in postmenopausal women the topical application of vitamin C is able to produce a coordinated increase in the steady-state level of the mRNA for collagen I and III as observed in six testers, and of their post-translational extracellular enzymes, as observed in at least, seven of the 10 testers. We speculated that the nonresponders might already have a concentration of the vitamin in skin great enough for maximal expression of the ascorbate-responsive mRNA.
The subjects in this study applied a "cream" with 5% L-Ascorbic Acid on their upper forearm once a day (at night) for 6 months. The cream had a pH of 6.0 and was silicone based. No other topically applied preparation was permitted. |
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Born 1953; Blonde-Blue; Normal skin |
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Mon Jan 03, 2011 12:41 pm |
From the same link you can find conflicting information. Again I just figured those who cannot tolerate the higher percentages and have the ingredients to DIY it sure can't hurt to see if a 5% solution works for them.
http://www.acnetreatmentlab.com/medicine-product-remedy-solution-cure/topical-ascorbic-acid-vitamin-c.htm
To be effective, topical ascorbic acid must be formulated at an acidic pH which is preferrably pH 3.5 or less. The skin penetration ability of topical ascorbic acid is dependent on its acidity. The more acidic the formulation the better is the skin penetration but skin irritation also increases. The concentration of topical ascorbic acid should be at least 10% to be effective and 20% for optimum skin absorption. A 20% concentration ascorbic acid solution is irritating enough that it may cause temporary redness and moderate stinging sensation. Studies have shown that Magnesium Ascorbyl Phosphate and Ascorbyl Palmitate is not as effective as L-Ascorbic acid solutions. Some manufucturers use these "alternative" forms of topical vitamin-C because they are more stable compared to L-ascorbic acid solutions but their effectiveness is questionable.
Studies have shown that ascorbic acid derivatives such as Magnesium Ascrobyl Phosphate and Ascorbyl Palmitate did not increase the levels of ascorbic acid in the skin.Topical ascorbic acid works better if it is combined with zinc sulfate and L-tyrosine.
( Source: Topical L-ascorbic Acid: Percutaneous Absorption Studies Pinnell SR, Yang H, Omar M, et al Dermatol Surg. 2001;27:137-142)
Application of 5% vitamin C cream resulted in a significant improvement in both fine and coarse wrinkles. Ultrastructural evidence of elastic-tissue repair confirmed the clinical improvement in the vitamin C group. The treatment was well-tolerated.
( Source: Topical vitamin C for photoaged skin,Townsend Letter for Doctors and Patients, Dec, 2005 by Alan R. Gaby)
"Vitamin C has the potential to enhance the density of dermal papillae, perhaps through the mechanism of angiogenesis. Topical vitamin C may have therapeutical effects for partial corrections of the regressive structural changes associated with the aging process".
( Source: Topically applied vitamin C increases the density of dermal papillae in aged human skin, Kirsten Sauermann, Sören Jaspers, Urte Koop, and Horst Wenck) |
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