Multiple problems, looking for advice
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Wed Nov 30, 2011 6:52 am

Hello everyone,

I'm a 28 year old female and I'm looking for advice on combating the following problems:

1: Extreme dark circles around the eyes (no puffiness, just darkness, perpetual "aged and tired" look). I get plenty of sleep and I drink plenty of water, so please don't recommend that as a solution. I'm looking for something topical that works because diet, sleep and hydration doesn't change a thing. I also take multi-vitamins, vitamin C and cod liver oil often. Still doesn't help. For what it's worth I smoke electronic cigarettes but these only contain a propylene-glycol base with nicotine. No combustion, no smoke.

2: Wrinkles under the eye area. I avoid the sun as much as possible and use sunscreen, but I still developed wrinkles under my eyes. The only two solutions that seem viable to me are dermarolling and Retin-A, but I can't find an online retailer that will sell Retin-A to Canada at a reasonable price. Does anyone have any suggestions? Is there anything else I can do to minimize my eye wrinkles? They're starting to show through/crack my makeup and I feel I'm too young to be dealing with them.

3: Facial redness, splotchiness. I've had this problem since I was a pre-teen. I think I might have rosacea. The creases of my nose are perpetually red despite countless products tried over the years. This redness has even spread down my nasal labial lines. It almost looks like a constant rash, but I wash my face twice a day. I've used mild, non-medicated cleansers (even baby shampoo), medicated anti-acne cleansers from Clean and Clear, regular bar soap and even Head and Shoulders when I suspected I might have seborrheic dermatitis. Nothing ever helps...

4: A general but seemingly rapid decline in the integrity of my skin. The problems above seem to be increasing in severity very quickly. Nasal labial fold (not really a fold, but a soft definition) seems to be getting more prominent. Wrinkles under eyes getting worse, fine forehead lines beginning to form, skin looking uneven, splotchy and old. I realize I'm not a teenager anymore but it seems like there was some genetic switch that turned on when I turned 25 and now everything is in a fast decline.

Any advice would be appreciated. Thank you!

free skin care · Wed Nov 30, 2011 8:02 am

If you have such significant issues with your skin, it's likely you will need a holistic approach to resolve it. Have you been to your family doctor to ensure you don't have an underlying health problem, or the dermatologist/ pharmacist for a diagnosis? You may find you have a dermatitis condition which has been somewhat hidden due to tobacco suppressing the immune system. Until you know which one you are unlikely to be able to successfully treat it. I don't have rosacea nor seborrhoeic dermatitis, but the naso-labial/ perioral region is where my skin freaks out if I over-exfoliate or apply an allergen. I have atopic eczema and contact dermatitis BTW.

I notice that all the cleansers you have tried contain alkaline or sulphate surfactants, these are powerful irritants and contra-indicated in any dry skin condition. Have you tried a non-foaming oil based cleanser? H&S is rubbish for SD, if you do have that you need an anti-fungal like Nizoral. Baby shampoo is less irritating to the eye mucosa not necessarily the skin. It is worth knowing that once the skin's barrier is breached, any chemicals it comes into contact with can be irritant - skincare, make up, laundry powder, fabric conditioner, shampoo bubbles etc.

You may find the wrinkles are not so much ageing as chronic dehydration/ a thickened stratus corneum as your skin tries to protect itself. This tends to be more visible on thinner skin with few sebacaeous glands such as round the eye. Gentle hydrating ingredients include urea, hyaluronic acid, aloe vera, calendula with allantoin, lanolin or olive squalane. Several of these have calming/ healing and anti-ageing properties. I would not recommend self prescribing Retin-A as this is not recommended for the eye area, not recommended for sensitive skin and can exacerbate dryness. Ditto Dermarolling: perhaps try rosehip seed oil which contains a natural form of vitamin A?

Sorry but I am going to comment on the lifestyle thing because that is my work background Embarassed

and I rarely see a client who ticks all the boxes. Why vitamins and cod liver oil, but no minerals or long chain omega-3s? Have you checked whether you are taking too high a dose of vitamins A or D between the multi and CLO? Are you choosing low glycaemic index carbs which help keep us hydrated, and avoiding sugar/ white carbs/ caffeine/ soda/ alcohol which are all inflammatory? Nicotine is a mild stimulant so it puts the body into a state of stress, which in turn causes low grade inflammation. Chronic inflammation is damaging to all cells in the body, including the skin. If you have quit smoking (well done BTW!) relatively recently, your body will still be eliminating poisons from the pulmonary and cardiovascular systems, plus you may still be nutrient deficient. Physical activity is necessary to stimulate the lymphatic and digestive systems, which help transport water and nutrients around the body and flush toxins out; are you consistently hitting 10,000 steps a day?

Sorry for the essay! Laughing

free skin care · Wed Nov 30, 2011 8:12 am

Wow, we have pretty much identical problems. Full disclosure: I'm still a newbie when it comes to the actual science behind skincare so take this advice with a grain of salt.

1. For dark circles, I've read that some people had brightened that area with vit c serum. Right now, I'm using YSL Touche Eclat to cover it. It goes on fairly light, so it looks natural rather than the really obvious reverse-racoon you get with normal concealers.

2. I get eye wrinkles too. But I've been studying pictures on Facebook and I've noticed the difference in skin quality of people who have tense vs relaxed facial muscles when they smile. My eye muscles are definitely tense, I even notice it when I'm lying in bed at night. I don't know if that's the case with you, but maybe try facial exercises and a super hydrating eye cream. I don't know if hyaluronic acid is safe to use around the eye area, but I've recently had a great experience using it on my face.

3. Maybe your face is dehydrated or irritated from the products you've been using?

4. Have you been stressing out? http://truthinaging.com/body/stress-gets-under-your-skin

Stress does age you. I know it's hard for me to stop obsessing over my skin too, but it could be counter-productive.

free skin care · Wed Nov 30, 2011 10:06 am

Hi marymag

Just wondering if you stare at the computer screen for hours? I find that to stress my eyes out and make me look tired. Also if you wear contacts or squint lots (presbyopia or dry eyes). The Tanaka massage might help with the strain. There's a thread with video links in the DIY sub forum.

Retin a you can get from a doc in Canada. Although I'm not sure I would recommend such a strong product for the delicate skin around the eyes. Try OTC products with retinol or retinaldehyde first.

I also agree that cleansers you've used seem a little too harsh and might be contributing to your splotchiness. You really might be better off with non foaming cleansers. Smile

Wed Nov 30, 2011 12:51 pm

I think they enjoy setting up services calls for known receiver issues so we spend an hour telling the cust we can't help them. Oh and then the whammy, cust calls back and we get a TC.

free skin care · Wed Nov 30, 2011 1:25 pm

At 25 I had skin issues, body issues which I was also too young to be dealing with. At 30 they resolved themselves with a change of diet and hormone balance. I dropped 15kgs in 3 months without exercise and all pigmentation on my skin vanished.

Hormone balance issues are insidious in that they may not manifest themselves in any obvious way and may look like other issues. But your hormone balance can affect a great deal of your appearance. If that is a cause, no topical will be effective. Given your age I would check that out first. Before resorting to strong topicals.

Wed Nov 30, 2011 6:20 pm

Hello everyone and thank you for the replies.

Firefox, no, I haven't been to a derm or a doctor, though I know I should and it's a bit foolish of me not to. I'm pretty self-conscious so I'm more inclined to self-help than do what's actually smart. You're probably right, given the redness it's likely I have some form of dermatitis or rosacea, especially since it's been chronic since I was 10-11 years old. I have oily skin that's prone to breakouts and cysts so I try not to use anything oil-based in my cleansers and moisturizers. Do you have a recommendation for something gentle for oily skin?

For moisturizer I've been using Burt's Bee's Milk and Honey body lotion. I know it's a body lotion but it's one of the few moisturizers I've found that goes on non-greasy so I've been using it on my face as well. It doesn't seem to exacerbate my splotchiness and the splotchiness doesn't go away when I discontinue use, so I figure it's okay.

As far as I know my vit A intake is within recommended levels. I'm aware it can cause problems in excessive doses so I've been careful. I've also made an effort to cut white carbs from my diet. I usually only have brown rice, brown breads, brown pastas (not very often). I slip up here and there but for the most part white carbs are something I avoid. I am a soda junky though, I probably drink 1-2 litres a week on average.

To answer a few questions about my lifestyle, it's not very active. I have a desk job so I'm sitting for most of the day and when I get home I don't actively exercise. Maybe you're right about it having an impact on the quality of my skin.

onmyboat, thank you for the recommendation of the vit C serum. I didn't know it could be used to lighten dark circles so I will definitely give that a try!

It's possible my eye muscles tense more than others but I'm not sure how to compare really.

My father died last month so I have been under a lot of stress, but these problems predate it so I'm thinking it's more because of other things.

circus, thanks for the reply, yes, at work I use a computer and usually go for 3-4 hour stretches at a time. Can this really cause dark circles? Is it the light from the monitor that causes it? Seems like a strange correlation but I won't discount it!

NotMeNotYou, I'm glad you brought up hormone issues because I've suspected I might have some. In the past 3 years the shape of my body has changed, the distribution of my fat (I'm about 15-20lbs overweight) is concentrating more on my belly whereas it didn't use to before. I'm also getting stray dark hairs on my chin and wispy hairs just below my hairline above my eyebrows. At 17 I stopped getting acne, but after a heat wave 2 years ago I started getting acne like I was a young teen again, mostly concentrated on the chin and jawline, sometimes the forehead. I have a lot of pink scars left over from it and though I know they'll fade, it's distressing in the meantime. Does this sound like something that could be caused by hormones and if so do you recommend a specific diet to treat it?

Thank you everyone for your replies!

free skin care · Thu Dec 01, 2011 1:58 am

It could be any number of things.

My boyfriend experienced moderate cystic acne at 28, even though he'd always had perfect skin his entire life. It turned out it was a gluten allergy Within 4 weeks of going gluten free he was acne free.

The only way to really be sure is to see a professional and get tested for hormone inbalance. Depending upon whats going on, the recommended diet\supplements will be different. A good reading place to start though is to Google, estrogen dominance. Youll be able to get an idea of what hormone imbalances are about by doing that. Its not something you can self diagnose though. You need to see someone skilled in that.

I was working with a woman 10yrs younger than me who complained that despite exerising and eating moderately she could not shift the extra 10kgs. I suggested she have her hormones checked, she did and sure enough got treatment and her weight came off easily.

Deterioration of the skin and weight gain can be signs of a hormone change if no other obvious factors are present. I always take an inside out approach to beauty. If the insides are out of whack then no cream will ever overcome it.

free skin care · Thu Dec 01, 2011 7:49 am

marymag

It is the glare from the computer screen that strains/ tenses the eyes. The dark eye circles are a result of a lack of circulation. Try taking a break every hour or so. The Tanaka massage can also help with circulation.

Also second Firefox's suggestion of physical activity. I had lots of problems when I switched to a desk bound job. Again it has to do with circulation. Maybe some household chores daily if you don't have time to hit the gym?

free skin care · Thu Dec 01, 2011 5:45 pm

marymag wrote:

Hello everyone and thank you for the replies.

Firefox, no, I haven't been to a derm or a doctor, though I know I should and it's a bit foolish of me not to. I'm pretty self-conscious so I'm more inclined to self-help than do what's actually smart. You're probably right, given the redness it's likely I have some form of dermatitis or rosacea, especially since it's been chronic since I was 10-11 years old. I have oily skin that's prone to breakouts and cysts so I try not to use anything oil-based in my cleansers and moisturizers. Do you have a recommendation for something gentle for oily skin?

For moisturizer I've been using Burt's Bee's Milk and Honey body lotion. I know it's a body lotion but it's one of the few moisturizers I've found that goes on non-greasy so I've been using it on my face as well. It doesn't seem to exacerbate my splotchiness and the splotchiness doesn't go away when I discontinue use, so I figure it's okay.

As far as I know my vit A intake is within recommended levels. I'm aware it can cause problems in excessive doses so I've been careful. I've also made an effort to cut white carbs from my diet. I usually only have brown rice, brown breads, brown pastas (not very often). I slip up here and there but for the most part white carbs are something I avoid. I am a soda junky though, I probably drink 1-2 litres a week on average.

To answer a few questions about my lifestyle, it's not very active. I have a desk job so I'm sitting for most of the day and when I get home I don't actively exercise. Maybe you're right about it having an impact on the quality of my skin.

My father died last month so I have been under a lot of stress, but these problems predate it so I'm thinking it's more because of other things.

Thank you everyone for your replies!

(((hugs))) So sorry to read you've had a tough time lately. Skincare is not about being foolish but if it is I certainly need to stand up and wave my arms around for I am guilty guilty guilty!! Wink

Without a diagnosis it will be difficult to get the skincare right, but there are some universal truths.

Firstly don't assume your skin is naturally oily: both lifestyle and products can cause or contribute to this. Physical stress is a potential culprit not just from life events but imbalanced diet, poor sleep patterns, being obese or underweight, sedentary, smoking etc. Don't beat yourself up about not exercising because you can be physically active without going to the gym. I wholeheartedly recommend getting moving because it is AMAZING for stress, insomnia, depression and confidence. Find something that works for you - vigorous housework, a dance club, hiking in nature, Wii sports, playing with young relatives, walking the neighbour's dog ...

Skincare wise anything that is exfoliating or drying or anti bacterial can stimulate the skin to produce oil to protect itself. For me and many others with chronic skin conditions foaming cleansers, especially those containing sulphate surfactants, are a problem. Just shampoo bubbles running down my arm is enough to set my elbow patch off!! Since I quit both my scalp and T-zone are MUCH less greasy. Also don't believe commercial hype that suggest that anything containing oil can block pores (comedogenic). It totally depends on the structure of the fatty acids, some are comedogenic and others not. Having said that definitely stick with that body lotion if your facial skin responds well to it! Very Happy

I apologise if my writing style comes over as preachy or negative, I really don't mean it and am a pussycat IRL. Embarassed

Trust that I have committed every skin sin except tobacco, despite the fact that I should know better (twenty years working in healthcare!!) so feel free to challenge or have fun with me.

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