Is retinol available from any ingredients supplier?
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Sat Jul 28, 2012 10:07 am

I want to make my own retinol gel, because my skin doesn't like some of the ingredients in the ready-made products out there. I've tried searching at a few sites, but I haven't found anything yet. Does anyone here know where I might be able to find pure retinol?

Thanks,
Ellen

free skin care · Sat Jul 28, 2012 10:27 am

These are the only types I've ever ran into myself:

http://stores.skinessentialactives.com/-strse-40/Retinol%2C-Vitamin-A-Acetate/Detail.bok

http://www.makingcosmetics.com/Vitamin-A-Microcaps-retinol-p327.html

So if this isn't what you're looking for, you might have to settle for retinyl palmitate.
Btw, does anybody else think it's weird that lotioncrafter doesn't carry any vitamin A derivatives? I've been ordering from them for years & I've never, ever seen any.

Sat Jul 28, 2012 11:08 am

Thank you! That looks like it will do the trick.

Ellen

free skin care · Sat Jul 28, 2012 12:25 pm

Oh really? Lol.
You're welcome! Smile

free skin care · Sat Jul 28, 2012 12:36 pm

Pharmaceutical/fine chemical suppliers almost always have it, some may even sell it for private uses. Parchem or Spectrum Chemicals or someone similar would likely have it.
However, unless I'm missing someone cheaper, pure all-trans-retinol (CAS# 68-26-8) is more on the expensive side of things. Most the quotes I've seen are so far are somewhere about $50 for 100 mg of retinol. With 100 mg you can DIY 20 g of product at a concentration of 0.5%.
I guess that's probably the reason why DIY skin care suppliers don't carry it and opt for diluted options and weaker ester forms.

Sat Jul 28, 2012 1:21 pm

OK, now I'm confused. Is "Retinol, Vitamin A Acetate" that I saw using one of the links above not actually retinol? Excuse my ignorance.

Thanks,
Ellen

free skin care · Sat Jul 28, 2012 7:34 pm

ellenelle wrote:

OK, now I'm confused. Is "Retinol, Vitamin A Acetate" that I saw using one of the links above not actually retinol? Excuse my ignorance.

Thanks,
Ellen

Vitamin A acetate (same thing as retinyl acetate and retinol acetate) and retinol are not the same. They are two different molecules and not interchangeable, and they don't work the same, although they are both different forms of vitamin A.
That link is very confusing, I'm honestly not sure what they sell in the end, by the CAS#, molar mass and formula it should be retinol, but the melting point listed is that of retinol acetate (retinol's is a few degrees higher), price seems to be off and name of the listing and the long list of "synonyms" which lists more than one form of vitamin A makes me suspicious as does the description that also refers to yet another different form of vitamin A - tretinoin (all-trans-retinoic acid), which is metabolic end point of all the other vitamin A forms, but has nothing to do with the description of either retinol or retinol acetate per se.

I would e-mail the company and ask for a copy of manufacturer's specifications. That retinol/vitamin A acetate entry is too messy to be trusted.

As I said earlier, a pharmaceutical supplier is your best bet if you want the real deal and reliability. Or just an example of what you should be looking for.
Here's one: https://www.spectrumchemical.com/OA_HTML/ibeCCtpItmDspRte.jsp?a=b&minisite=10020&respid=50577&item=1&itemGrpNum=R1474&isSupply=0

Sun Jul 29, 2012 6:08 am

Thanks for that clarification. I will contact the seller.

Let's say that this product is merely retinyl acetate; what are the effects of that? Is it simply the same only weaker? Does it depend on one's ability to convert? Are the effects even known?

Thanks,
Ellen

free skin care · Sun Jul 29, 2012 10:39 am

Weaker - yes, in the sense that, in theory, a higher dose of ester form is required to achieve similar result as with using retinoic acid directly. There is no clear consensus how much more is needed, but usually it's between 20-30 times more compared to retinoic acid, however, that estimate is based on animal studies, rats, mice, rabbits, not humans.
Personally I've never seen direct comparison between ester forms and the more active vitamin A forms when it comes to skin, but as long as it is ensured that retinyl acetate is absorbed, it's safe to say that skin will hydrolyze it and retinol will be made out of the retinyl acetate. However, I have never seen any direct evidence that retinoic acid in skin is created when any of the storage forms, acetate, palmitate or linolate are applied. Not implying that it doesn't happen, it simply might be unresearched at the moment. In rodent skin retinyl acetate does cause epidermal hyperplasia meaning it does increase cell turnover and leads to skin thickening. One interesting human study does mention that retinyl acetate together with poly hydroxy acid improves aged skin, but same happens with poly hydroxy acid alone, no direct proof of retinyl acetate's effectiveness.
Getting retinyl acetate into skin might be tricky part, because ester forms have very "little interest" into getting inside skin. Retinoic acid (tretinoin), for example, penetrates skin very rapidly, depending on the vehicle, it takes minutes.
To be honest, apart from the claims skin care manufacturers make, I've yet to see solid proof that retinyl acetate is anywhere as good for skin as retinol or tretinoin. The most useful application I know for retinyl acetate is derma-needling because of the less irritating nature of ester forms and in case derma-needling the penetration issue is solved automatically as well.

Sun Jul 29, 2012 4:35 pm

Thanks for such a detailed reply.

I think I may have uncovered why it is not available from small suppliers. At the all-trans-retinol page at coleparmer it says: "This item is considered a hazardous material. This item(s) cannot be shipped to residential addresses, sold to private individuals, and may not be available outside of the United States. This item(s) cannot ship freight collect or by any priority air service. Please note: there may be additional shipping restrictions and/or charges for these items." Yikes!

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