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Tue Oct 08, 2013 1:52 am  |
as the title reads. i want to exercise but i read running and jumping does cause face sagging.
how about bicycle or spinning or very fast or brisk walking?
thanks |
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Tue Oct 08, 2013 3:33 am |
Believe it or not, but firmness of my skin actually increased since starting higher intensity workouts. High impact stuff like running and plyo is what I'm talking about here, 2-3 times a week.
Not that I ever placed much faith in the notion that jumping up and down causes sagging in first place. And then I look at my co-worker who is the most extreme example I know being in her mid-40s and only workouts she does is jumping up and down on a trampoline and looks great, no sag anywhere, face or boobs... In my experience the ones that don't work out much or at all have the hardest time fighting gravity, not the other way round. |
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Do what all good pragmatists do. Compromise. |
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Tue Oct 08, 2013 11:08 am |
| Toxic habits and diet causes sagging .Not exercise. |
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We shall not cease from exploration, and the end of all our exploring will be to arrive where we started and know the place for the first time. |
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Wed Oct 09, 2013 3:46 am |
Check the studies Panos, there is evidence suggesting otherwise now!
Plus those that have so called healthy diets don't always look that great. Exception is Mimi Kirk or Tonya Zavastro but a lot of others I've seen I havent' felt drawn to trying out their diets based on their looks.
| panoslydios wrote: |
| Toxic habits and diet causes sagging .Not exercise. |
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Wed Oct 09, 2013 5:20 am |
| TheresaMary wrote: |
Check the studies Panos, there is evidence suggesting otherwise now!
Plus those that have so called healthy diets don't always look that great. Exception is Mimi Kirk or Tonya Zavastro but a lot of others I've seen I havent' felt drawn to trying out their diets based on their looks.
| panoslydios wrote: |
| Toxic habits and diet causes sagging .Not exercise. |
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so jogging does cause facial sagging? |
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Wed Oct 09, 2013 7:48 am |
I don't believe it was jogging but rebounding that was mentioned specifically - with both causing facial skin to sag and also bladder issues (for us women).
I also read something about high impact aerobics at one point but can't find it yet, but it was written about before.
I've heard jogging has given some people bad results, but depends where you are jogging - i.e. hard concrete floor is going to give a different result than natural earth.
| Salome_B wrote: |
| TheresaMary wrote: |
Check the studies Panos, there is evidence suggesting otherwise now!
Plus those that have so called healthy diets don't always look that great. Exception is Mimi Kirk or Tonya Zavastro but a lot of others I've seen I havent' felt drawn to trying out their diets based on their looks.
| panoslydios wrote: |
| Toxic habits and diet causes sagging .Not exercise. |
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so jogging does cause facial sagging? |
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Wed Oct 09, 2013 7:50 am |
Found a link here that says jogging is bad:
http://www.cosmeticsurgery.com/articles/archive/an~185
Jogging -- Bad For Your Skin!
With a current epidemic of obesity happening everywhere among all age groups in America, more people are taking up some form of exercise in hopes of knocking off some of that unsightly flesh. Already, some 22 million Americans make a habit of jogging for health, exercise and – believe it or not -- fun.
But a Colorado plastic surgeon has made some comparisons of his jogging and non-jogging patients while they were under the knife and urges a word of caution to those who want to take up running.
“Beware of jogging,” warns Denver plastic surgeon John A. Grossman, M.D. “Jogging can be bad for your skin! It can be particularly hard on the skin of both mens’ and womens’ faces. “For your skin’s sake, give up jogging and get a bike!” he says.
Science has already learned how year after year of jogging can be hard on ankles, knees and hips. It’s because the weight of your body is multiplied by a factor of five or six every time a foot strikes the ground. Jogging downhill is especially hard on the body and the underlying collagen as well as tissues of the face, breast, thighs and buttocks.
“I’m not saying forget exercise,” adds Dr. Grossman. “Just take up some form of low-impact workout like a bicycle, an elliptical trainer or swimming. “The hard impact and repetitive up and down motion of jogging on land or on a treadmill tears collagen, the body’s building block that creates healthy, youthful skin,” he says. “Your skin is something like a rubber band -- continuous stretching through bouncing up and down causes it to lose elasticity. Plus, as we age the impact is much more dramatic.”
Because Dr. Grossman has spent so many years working closely with skin during various rejuvenation surgeries, he started noticing that patients who jog had much more saggy skin everywhere on their bodies compared to non-running patients. And, the older the patient, the worse the effect. He matched notes with other plastic surgeons and eventually mentioned his observation to an exercise physiologist who said it makes perfect sense.
“I think that no amount of jogging is good,” Dr. Grossman says. Hollywood funny lady Joan Rivers would agree. She has often said, the first time she sees a jogger smiling, she’ll consider taking it up. |
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Wed Oct 09, 2013 8:53 am |
| TheresaMary wrote: |
Found a link here that says jogging is bad:
http://www.cosmeticsurgery.com/articles/archive/an~185
Jogging -- Bad For Your Skin!
With a current epidemic of obesity happening everywhere among all age groups in America, more people are taking up some form of exercise in hopes of knocking off some of that unsightly flesh. Already, some 22 million Americans make a habit of jogging for health, exercise and – believe it or not -- fun.
But a Colorado plastic surgeon has made some comparisons of his jogging and non-jogging patients while they were under the knife and urges a word of caution to those who want to take up running.
“Beware of jogging,” warns Denver plastic surgeon John A. Grossman, M.D. “Jogging can be bad for your skin! It can be particularly hard on the skin of both mens’ and womens’ faces. “For your skin’s sake, give up jogging and get a bike!” he says.
Science has already learned how year after year of jogging can be hard on ankles, knees and hips. It’s because the weight of your body is multiplied by a factor of five or six every time a foot strikes the ground. Jogging downhill is especially hard on the body and the underlying collagen as well as tissues of the face, breast, thighs and buttocks.
“I’m not saying forget exercise,” adds Dr. Grossman. “Just take up some form of low-impact workout like a bicycle, an elliptical trainer or swimming. “The hard impact and repetitive up and down motion of jogging on land or on a treadmill tears collagen, the body’s building block that creates healthy, youthful skin,” he says. “Your skin is something like a rubber band -- continuous stretching through bouncing up and down causes it to lose elasticity. Plus, as we age the impact is much more dramatic.”
Because Dr. Grossman has spent so many years working closely with skin during various rejuvenation surgeries, he started noticing that patients who jog had much more saggy skin everywhere on their bodies compared to non-running patients. And, the older the patient, the worse the effect. He matched notes with other plastic surgeons and eventually mentioned his observation to an exercise physiologist who said it makes perfect sense.
“I think that no amount of jogging is good,” Dr. Grossman says. Hollywood funny lady Joan Rivers would agree. She has often said, the first time she sees a jogger smiling, she’ll consider taking it up. |
how about spinning or exercise bike? recently i have been through a very rough patch plus i have super irritated skin thanks to a liz earle moisturiser. i think at 25 years old my face is starting to sag. very very sad. i also cannot use retin a |
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Wed Oct 09, 2013 9:29 am |
Gravity and "pulling down" your skin have absolutely nothing to do with it. Here is what Nicholas Perricone, M.D. has to say:
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I know, to a nation of couch potatoes, it seems hard to believe that it is possible to get too much exercise. However, typical Western forms of exercise are designed to make our heart and lungs work hard. The principal aims of this kind of exercise are building good muscle tone, burning fat and increasing endurance.
While these goals are worthy and important, we need to be careful when performing vigorous physical exercise. Too much exertion increases oxygen demand beyond the optimum level. This causes the production of inflammatory free radicals that accelerate cellular degeneration (and thus the aging process).
Ironically, the wrong type of exercise will backfire by accelerating the aging process. While there is a vital role for aerobic types of exercise, it is important they are not overdone. |
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/dr-nicholas-perricone/madonna-salmon-queen_b_174843.html |
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Photo taken Oct 28, 2013: http://bit.ly/17Umeou |
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Wed Oct 09, 2013 11:03 am |
LOL
I lose hope in people today.
Exercise your body or you will lose it.
Exercise your face or you will lose it.
Use your immune system or you will lose it.
It has always been that way from day 1.
Jogging stimulates lymphs in certain parts and if you do it barefoot at the sea its an elimination therapy at its own.
Rebounding exercises ORGANS.
I dont know whats wrong with these dumb article writers.Who knows ,maybe they have never been out to nature and exercise,and feel the health benefits.
Dopes head and plastic surgeons seem to name everything healthy as toxic,because either their mind has become toxic or everything healthy doesnt promote their incomes. |
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We shall not cease from exploration, and the end of all our exploring will be to arrive where we started and know the place for the first time. |
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Wed Oct 09, 2013 11:40 am |
| I agree, panoslydios. They stand to lose a LOT of money if people actually do the right things to get and stay healthy, like exercise, eat right, and as you say, get out into nature. Fresh air. Sunshine. Not only will your body be healthier because of it, but so will your mind. |
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Photo taken Oct 28, 2013: http://bit.ly/17Umeou |
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Wed Oct 09, 2013 1:45 pm |
I do have to admit when I first read of runner's face, I did make a point at comparing faces of runners with those of people of the same age who do other exercises and there did seem to be something to the theory. The Olympics was a good place to further witness this trend.
Personally, I do not like any exercise that involves bouncing. Years ago, I read a Yoga book that said such exercises make everything sag. It may have actually said "organs" since that is what my mind recalls...but all I thought was "OMG BOOBS LOOKING LIKE BANANAS!" The idea of giving gravity a hand in elongating my boobs is stuff nightmares are made of...so that thought alone was enough for me to avoid any exercise that involves bouncing. And no regrets here, for despite my huge weight loss at the start of the 90's and an increase in cup size, I am happy to say gravity isn't winning in that department.  (Oh and before someone mentions sports bras, I do know about them and do wear them WITH my bra underneath and I still won't bounce.  )
No one is saying not to exercise. But exercise does not have to involve bouncing. I mean, I don't think it is such a farfetched thought that rebounding exercise can cause disused muscles to elongate. Heck people's faces elongate anyway when they don't bounce...so imagine the effect of a repeated up-and-down motion. For a visual, think of how pizza dough would stretch if it were suspended in mid-air and how much faster it would stretch if you shook it vertically while suspended in mid-air.
Aerobic exercises like cycling/spinning, swimming, the elliptical machine, speed walking which don't involve any rebound will work your heart and lungs just like running or rope-jumping, only without you risking joint damage, extra-saggy boobs, and (ahem) "runner's face". I also think exercises like Yoga, Callanetics, Lotte Berk... which do not involve bouncing, are a great way to keep the body in good condition.
Personally when in doubt or if there might be a slim chance there is some truth to this and when there are so many other options, why take the chance? I didn't read any scientific studies on the Yoga hypothesis I read years ago...but I can tell you I haven't had to pay out any more money than I normally would to enrich anyone by following that advice. In fact, I might have saved some dough because for someone who likes having perky boobs, I probably saved myself the need for a breast lift.
So while money may drive some theories...I doubt it is the case here with "runner's face" because if I liked running and this scared me from doing it, I'd not have to join a gym and pay to use machines; I would switch to walking fast or stay home and dance like no one's watching...and get as good a workout as always. |
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Wed Oct 09, 2013 5:16 pm |
I'm still not convinced runners face exists and is caused by whatever. Maybe it's something that's more pronounced in daily long distance runners.
The only sources for this I've found so far are DailyMail-like sites that quote some plastic surgeons and not much of any other hard evidence (pictures! gimme!). Not accepting gutter as source for sķin care information, sorry.
Obviously, I'm biased and willing to defend activities that I enjoy.
In meantime, watching closely for extra sag in people waddling along. It's a bit of a challange since most joggers seem to be in their gray-hair years and I'm having helluva time guesstimating sun damage and impact damage ratios. So far I'm still seeing un-fit and fat people's skins and what not literally rippling on impact even when they just walk. Fit people seem to have tighter skin that just does not bounce around much even if they are a bit on the curvy side.
Looking at pro/semi athletes who run around a lot (soccer players and such) and should have skin folds draping to their knees by the time they are 35 and yet they don't seem extra saggy or haggerd. Or my eyesight's gone due to aging, which is probably why all this talk makes me think of time when ladies wrapped and banaged their faces in hopes that doing so would prevent jowls and turkey neck. How did that work out exactly? |
_________________
Do what all good pragmatists do. Compromise. |
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Wed Oct 09, 2013 6:49 pm |
| There is a woman who I graduated with (30 years ago next summer) who is a runner and runs in many, many events. She is very physically fit but is not aging very well whereas in High School, she looked younger than her given age. Some of it might be genetic but some of it is the running. I think Dr. Perricone is right in that "runner's face" is a result of oxidation and free radicals. |
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Photo taken Oct 28, 2013: http://bit.ly/17Umeou |
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Wed Oct 09, 2013 7:01 pm |
Maybe it is mostly long-distance runners for whom this is true.
Haile Gebrselassie born in 1973 does not look like he's only 40.
German professional long-distance runner Irina Mikitenko born in 1972 does not look like she is only 41.
Long distance runner Deena Kastor born in 1973 looks older to me than 40.
Marathon runner Paula Radcliff born in 1973 doesn't look as old as Haile her agemate but I would have guessed her to be about 50.
I would have guessed Tyson Gay (sprinter) shown here at the age of 29 to be around 40+ from that pic.
Marathon world record holder Paul Makau born in 1985 looks much older than 28.
Nicole Bush does steeplechase which is running and jumping...double trouble if you ask me. And she was only 20 when this article was written but doesn't look it to me. |
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Wed Oct 09, 2013 7:35 pm |
Just about all the runners Nonie showed have quite a few wrinkles. I just looked at my classmate's pics (she's my friend on Facebook) again and she is exactly my age but has many, many wrinkles. Similar to Sarah Jessica Parker but worse, if that makes sense.
It's not "facial sag" that's the problem for these runners. It's wrinkles. So again, I don't think 'gravity pulling your face down' is the issue at all. My runner friend does not have sag in her face. Her face is full of wrinkles. They are all around her eyes, all over her forehead, on both cheeks. I don't think finding a "lower impact" exercise is going to change the "oxidation" problem. I personally do a PACE workout for my daily exercise. |
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Photo taken Oct 28, 2013: http://bit.ly/17Umeou |
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Wed Oct 09, 2013 7:59 pm |
What I noticed during the Olympics was a lot of sag of the lower face kinda like you see in Irina's face here.
I also noticed it in the runners shown on this blog page at a meet-and-greet featuring vegan ultra-marathon runner Scott Jurek and author of Eat and Run.
But then again, maybe they all lost weight after taking up running.... |
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Thu Oct 10, 2013 2:46 am |
Salome
I wouldn’t worry about this at your age, instead focus on your general health and getting better. You’ve written about what you are going through on other threads, so I want to encourage you to the same route everyone else is which is fixing your health first and your depression. Get yourself to the doctor and get help because the state you are in is not going to help you reverse the sagging etc.
| Salome_B wrote: |
| how about spinning or exercise bike? recently i have been through a very rough patch plus i have super irritated skin thanks to a liz earle moisturiser. i think at 25 years old my face is starting to sag. very very sad. i also cannot use retin a |
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Thu Oct 10, 2013 2:50 am |
This isn’t my opinion but as you will see from that article it has to do with Dr. Grossman, Nicholas Perricone has some unusual ideas, and has a very strict regime of both diet and skincare topicals, and so if you choose to follow his routing, good for you but he’s not the only derm out there and there are many who have shared their opinions that its bad for you.
| AngelaE8654 wrote: |
Gravity and "pulling down" your skin have absolutely nothing to do with it. Here is what Nicholas Perricone, M.D. has to say:
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I know, to a nation of couch potatoes, it seems hard to believe that it is possible to get too much exercise. However, typical Western forms of exercise are designed to make our heart and lungs work hard. The principal aims of this kind of exercise are building good muscle tone, burning fat and increasing endurance.
While these goals are worthy and important, we need to be careful when performing vigorous physical exercise. Too much exertion increases oxygen demand beyond the optimum level. This causes the production of inflammatory free radicals that accelerate cellular degeneration (and thus the aging process).
Ironically, the wrong type of exercise will backfire by accelerating the aging process. While there is a vital role for aerobic types of exercise, it is important they are not overdone. |
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/dr-nicholas-perricone/madonna-salmon-queen_b_174843.html |
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Thu Oct 10, 2013 2:52 am |
Strange..... as sometimes I lose hope too reading messages like this.
It has not always been like that since day 1. Rebounding has actually had studies where it has shown the constant up and down causes an impact on the internal organs, and particularly it was found for women in their 60’s to cause their bladder to be impacted so much and actually change its position within the body and become weaker as a result of the constant stress.
Rebounding is not the kind of exercise you get in the natural world, nor would you get earthing benefits from doing it on a rubber rebounder. Think before you respond Panos!
| panoslydios wrote: |
LOL
I lose hope in people today.
Exercise your body or you will lose it.
Exercise your face or you will lose it.
Use your immune system or you will lose it.
It has always been that way from day 1.
Jogging stimulates lymphs in certain parts and if you do it barefoot at the sea its an elimination therapy at its own.
Rebounding exercises ORGANS.
I dont know whats wrong with these dumb article writers.Who knows ,maybe they have never been out to nature and exercise,and feel the health benefits.
Dopes head and plastic surgeons seem to name everything healthy as toxic,because either their mind has become toxic or everything healthy doesnt promote their incomes. |
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Thu Oct 10, 2013 2:54 am |
I agree too, but comparing a rebounder to being a “natural method” of exercise is silly because it is not. Furthermore the fact that several of my friends jumped on the rebounder method 10 years ago (pardon the pun) and did it religiously because of some unqualified person saying it was beneficial, all of them ended up having problems. Variety of different people, genetics etc, but all using that same method – is that a coincidence? Hmm… not so sure particularly as you can read various feedback from other women saying they have had issues too from rebounding.
| AngelaE8654 wrote: |
| I agree, panoslydios. They stand to lose a LOT of money if people actually do the right things to get and stay healthy, like exercise, eat right, and as you say, get out into nature. Fresh air. Sunshine. Not only will your body be healthier because of it, but so will your mind. |
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Thu Oct 10, 2013 2:59 am |
Also with runners, both sprinters and long distance they tend to have quite low levels of body fat (because they have to be fast etc) so I often think that because of that their faces and sag aren’t as well hidden as someone who is perhaps a little plumper maybe.
Also there is a vast difference between jogging on say concrete which would impact all of your joints, bones etc and jogging say on natural earth too.
| AngelaE8654 wrote: |
Just about all the runners Nonie showed have quite a few wrinkles. I just looked at my classmate's pics (she's my friend on Facebook) again and she is exactly my age but has many, many wrinkles. Similar to Sarah Jessica Parker but worse, if that makes sense.
It's not "facial sag" that's the problem for these runners. It's wrinkles. So again, I don't think 'gravity pulling your face down' is the issue at all. My runner friend does not have sag in her face. Her face is full of wrinkles. They are all around her eyes, all over her forehead, on both cheeks. I don't think finding a "lower impact" exercise is going to change the "oxidation" problem. I personally do a PACE workout for my daily exercise. |
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Thu Oct 10, 2013 3:00 am |
Panoslydios - who says any of these atheletes were taking "dope". They more than likely weren't at all. Stop being silly here. These are professionals who are competing in races etc and would be incredibly unlikely to do something like this.
| panoslydios wrote: |
| Who knows what all of these dudes were taking for dope. |
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