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LED after Rolling
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Hittin40
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Sun Apr 20, 2014 5:14 pm      Reply with quote
Happy Easter!! I was wondering how many of you use the LED after rolling. Do you use it immediately after or do you wait a day or two?
Thanks
havana8
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Mon Apr 21, 2014 8:15 am      Reply with quote
Although a bit older, this thread might be helpful:

Dermarolling and LED's
http://www.essentialdayspa.com/forum/viewthread.php?tid=37289
fawnie
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Mon Apr 21, 2014 4:54 pm      Reply with quote
Dr Setterfield and Dr Fernandes both are big on LED immediately after rolling for anti-inflammation now. The wavelengths that Setterfield recs are:

red: 633nm for collagen turnover
near infrared: 780nm for keratinocytes
near infrared: 830nm for macrophages

These are different wavelengths than most of our home devices tho. BabyQ Plus has these wavelengths: 610nm, 630nm, 660nm and 850nm. BabyQ cites the NASA study on burn healing using these nm.

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Hittin40
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Thu Apr 24, 2014 11:25 am      Reply with quote
Thanks for that Fawnie!! I guess led will be on the agenda after the next roll!!
cm5597
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Thu Apr 24, 2014 6:03 pm      Reply with quote
fawnie wrote:
Dr Setterfield and Dr Fernandes both are big on LED immediately after rolling for anti-inflammation now. The wavelengths that Setterfield recs are:

red: 633nm for collagen turnover
near infrared: 780nm for keratinocytes
near infrared: 830nm for macrophages

These are different wavelengths than most of our home devices tho. BabyQ Plus has these wavelengths: 610nm, 630nm, 660nm and 850nm. BabyQ cites the NASA study on burn healing using these nm.


Fawnie,

This is great information! Thank you!

Do you or does anyone else know of a place that lists all the wavelengths used in the most popular LED devices?

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fawnie
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Thu Apr 24, 2014 6:40 pm      Reply with quote
No sorry I only know the specs of BabyQ Plus and LightStim. LightStim is 605, 630, 660 and 855.

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cm5597
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Sat Apr 26, 2014 7:16 am      Reply with quote
fawnie wrote:
No sorry I only know the specs of BabyQ Plus and LightStim. LightStim is 605, 630, 660 and 855.


Thanks, Fawnie! Do you use either LightStim or BabyQ Plus?

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Wed May 28, 2014 3:50 pm      Reply with quote
cm5597 wrote:
fawnie wrote:
No sorry I only know the specs of BabyQ Plus and LightStim. LightStim is 605, 630, 660 and 855.


Thanks, Fawnie! Do you use either LightStim or BabyQ Plus?


fawnie, I want to know too! Which LED do you use? Wink
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Fri Jun 06, 2014 4:37 pm      Reply with quote
I have both Quasar Plus and AALS but I like the smaller head on the Quasar better. Both have similar LED wavelengths.

Im willing to send AALS to a loving home if anyone wants it for a decent price. Ive hardly used it - I dont like the large flat head.

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LauraLizzie
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Sun Jun 08, 2014 11:52 am      Reply with quote
How much is a reasonable price?

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Sun Jun 08, 2014 2:29 pm      Reply with quote
What would you offer?

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LauraLizzie
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Sun Jun 08, 2014 3:27 pm      Reply with quote
First remind me what AALS stands for so I can look up the price!

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Sun Jun 08, 2014 3:40 pm      Reply with quote
fawnie wrote:
I have both Quasar Plus and AALS but I like the smaller head on the Quasar better. Both have similar LED wavelengths.

Im willing to send AALS to a loving home if anyone wants it for a decent price. Ive hardly used it - I dont like the large flat head.


fawnie, How do you feel about the Quasar MD Plus: worth the splurge?

http://www.babyquasar.com/products/detail/quasar-md-plus
fawnie
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Sun Jun 08, 2014 4:04 pm      Reply with quote
Not for me RS. The Quasar MD Plus has that big old head on it that is too hard to maneuver around my small face. Its supposed to take less time for a treatment tho.

Image

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howInteresting
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Sun Jun 08, 2014 7:13 pm      Reply with quote
fawnie, weren't you against the use of LED's? Oxidative stress, or something like that? If you've changed your mind, can you tell us why? Thanks!
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Mon Jun 09, 2014 6:55 am      Reply with quote
fawnie wrote:
Not for me RS. The Quasar MD Plus has that big old head on it that is too hard to maneuver around my small face. Its supposed to take less time for a treatment tho.

Image


From the website:

Baby Quasar MD PLUS is "50% More powerful than the Baby Quasar PLUS" Think
fawnie
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Mon Jun 09, 2014 2:43 pm      Reply with quote
howInteresting wrote:
fawnie, weren't you against the use of LED's? Oxidative stress, or something like that? If you've changed your mind, can you tell us why? Thanks!


For use after dermal needling, Setterfield and Fernandes seem to be in love with LED, so I use it for 20 min then only.

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fawnie
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Tue Jun 10, 2014 7:36 pm      Reply with quote
Setterfield cites this publication:

"There is strong evidence of an anti-inflammatory effect from LLLT [ie LED], which is consistent across all 12 tested laboratory models and phases of inflammation and wavelengths between 633 and 904 nm. The magnitude of the antiinflammatory effect is not significantly different from that of non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drugs (NSAIDs), but it is slightly less than glucocorticoid steroids."
http://www.researchgate.net/publication/233628304_The_anti-inflammatory_mechanism_of_low_level_laser_therapy_and_its_relevance_for_clinical_use_in_physiotherapy

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RussianSunshine
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Sun Feb 14, 2016 6:59 pm      Reply with quote
Bumping this thread up!

Is anyone else using LED therapy after dermal needling? What are the results?
semolinapilchard
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Mon Feb 15, 2016 8:29 pm      Reply with quote
I still haven't done it, even though I've had a roller/stamps and LEDs for years, as well as acne scarring. (Once bitten.) But this to me was the thread that sold me on the process:

http://www.acne.org/messageboard/topic/217908-ok-guys/?page=1

It looks like his images mightn't be up anymore but I saw them at the time and there was rather remarkable improvement.

Think it's time I finally bite the bullet and do this.
RussianSunshine
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Mon Feb 15, 2016 10:47 pm      Reply with quote
Sarah Vaughter from owndoc really does not believe in LED therapy. That's what she wrote on her forum:

"It is clear that "Baby Quasar" definitely does not induce any collagen formation. In my opinion, is a complete waste of (very much) money. There have been studies done that seem to corroborate their claims, but I do not put the slightest credence in that device of theirs, after having read their website thoroughly."

http://forums.owndoc.com/dermarolling-microneedling/your-opinion-please-led39s-%28baby-quasar%29-and-copper-peptides/
fawnie
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Wed Feb 17, 2016 10:16 am      Reply with quote
Well, bless her heart, then she's in direct contradiction with NASA studies and the dermal needling gurus! Laughing

The use of LED after needling is to reduce inflammation, increase permeability and stimulate ATP, according to Fernandes.
skinwellness.co.nz/led-light-treatments/

The original NASA studies with LED confirmed that it does induce healing of burn tissue, and activates DNA synthesis as deep as the calf muscle. Muscle atrophy is a huge problem on space flights so LED was investigated as a stimulatory modality to counteract it. Also, wounds heal slower in the spaceship environment so LED was similarly investigated.
www.activeforever.com/content/manuals/A17157-NASA-LED-Space-Flight.pdf

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tigerlily009
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Fri Feb 19, 2016 8:49 am      Reply with quote
Yeah,
I'm pretty much a firm believer in both microneedling and LED based on the studies I've read.
Maybe Sarah Vaughter has changed her mind since 2010 when that thread was written.
I know I've changed my mind about many things in the past 6 years.
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