early review :: Vivant Mandelic Acid 15% - pore tightening!
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free skin care · Sun Oct 01, 2006 12:52 am

Quote:

Would this be too intense for a younger skin?

Hi Cuppre
I was answering Lucinda's Q before that. I assumed as she didn't get a reply that she'd asked your age to see if you were a similar age to her and giving it a go. Just a guess Confused

In answer to your Qs
Mandelic acid is an AHA.
Best to start with 2% salicylic
the rest I don't know about, sorry.

free skin care · Sun Oct 01, 2006 1:00 am

Molly wrote:

Quote:

Would this be too intense for a younger skin?

Hi Cuppre
I was answering Lucinda's Q before that. I assumed as she didn't get a reply that she'd asked your age to see if you were a similar age to her and giving it a go. Just a guess Confused

In answer to your Qs
Mandelic acid is an AHA.
Best to start with 2% salicylic
the rest I don't know about, sorry.

Lol, sorry about the confusion and thanks for being so nice.

I will start with the 2% salicylic acid now, and I am just wondering if there are any differences between various companies' formulas in terms of actual effectiveness of use?

free skin care · Sun Oct 01, 2006 7:56 am

Molly wrote:

Hi Lucinda
In response to your question about age above and seeing that your skin is dehydrated from your footer I would say the Vivant 15% could very well be too much for you. There's a lot of alcohol in it and it does dry the skin out. I don't recommend AHAs for younger skin anyhow because the corneal layer is already thinner than ours and your turnover should be much quicker too. You could make yourself sun-sensitive.

What are you trying to achieve with the Mandelic? Do you have congested pores?

You don't recommend AHA's EVER?... Oh no....
I use AHA's ALL the time! I recently cut down my use of active serum to only a couple of nights per week. But I also use JB apple peel and PSF pumpkin peel...

I wanted to try Mandelic to even out my skin tone. I have some sun damage (I think a small patch of melasma) and some post acne scarring.

Thanks for your help. Smile

free skin care · Sun Oct 01, 2006 8:10 am

Hi Lucinda
Don't be alarmed. It's just my opinion and I'm not an expert. Besides I don't like telling people not to do something. I'd really like to hear other peoples' opinions on this actually, but very few seem to have one.

It's based on the fact that the skin's natural exfoliation doesn't even start to slow until after around the age of 25. Until then the corneal layer is thinner and more vulnerable to sun damage already. Really it's on that basis that I think this, though I understand it can help people prone to acne because they get a build up of dead skin cells.

I was looking into this because a couple of people asked, but really there doesn't seem to be any research saying whether it's positive or negative for younger skin.

I asked over onwww.smartskincare.com forum and Dr Todorov thought it was unnecessary and possibly detrimental for young skin.

I also asked Darren of PSF and he thought it was OK and possibly beneficial in moderation, but not to exfoliate excessively like some young users.

That's as far as it went - no-one seems to know. It's purely speculation.

Anyway I do think the alcohol in the Vivant would be too much for already dehydrated skin which can be a sign of over-exfoliation anyway.

Molly Cool

free skin care · Sun Oct 01, 2006 8:20 am

Thanks Molly! I really think that you could be right. I will cut down on my AHA's some more. But if I do start to breakout, I will add them back in. I would rather not have to deal with scarring, and practically every blemish I get leaves a scar of some some, even if I don't pick at it.
Thanks!

free skin care · Sun Oct 01, 2006 8:27 am

cuppre wrote:

I am convinced to try the Mandelic Acid now. Very Happy

Just a quick question, I am currently using Benzac 2.5% BP. Can I use the mandelic acid as a substitute?

Would my routine be:
1. Cleanse
2. Mandelic Acid (30 mins)
3. BHA (I have not used BHA before, should I use 2% or 5%?)
4. Emu Oil
6. HA

My skin is generally normal (yay!), with some flaky patches Sad

, and a slightly congested forehead. Benzac has helped to do away with obvious pimples.

TIA

I think you'll find that the mandelic, BHA and Emu Oil will all address the pimples. I would focus the BHA (start w/2%) on the forehead where the congestion is. It is a good exfoliator but so is Mandelic so I don't think you need both all over since your skin is generally normal. So, do this:

1. Cleanse (make sure is "clean" as possible w/out nasties, if not, wait for skin to return to normal Ph - usually about 10-15 minutes)
2. 2% BHA (on forehead only or other congestion) - let sink in then apply #3
3. Mandelic Acid (30 mins)
4. Emu Oil
6. HA (you can mix this w/emu directly)

Re: the #1 rec, this is often overlooked and can be the cause of problems resulting from a compromised skin barrier. My skin has clear IMMENSELY since changing my routine and that included finding good cleansers. Smile

free skin care · Sun Oct 01, 2006 8:30 am

Molly wrote:

Hi Lucinda
Don't be alarmed. It's just my opinion and I'm not an expert. Besides I don't like telling people not to do something. I'd really like to hear other peoples' opinions on this actually, but very few seem to have one.

It's based on the fact that the skin's natural exfoliation doesn't even start to slow until after around the age of 25. Until then the corneal layer is thinner and more vulnerable to sun damage already. Really it's on that basis that I think this, though I understand it can help people prone to acne because they get a build up of dead skin cells.

I was looking into this because a couple of people asked, but really there doesn't seem to be any research saying whether it's positive or negative for younger skin.

I asked over onwww.smartskincare.com forum and Dr Todorov thought it was unnecessary and possibly detrimental for young skin.

I also asked Darren of PSF and he thought it was OK and possibly beneficial in moderation, but not to exfoliate excessively like some young users.

That's as far as it went - no-one seems to know. It's purely speculation.

Anyway I do think the alcohol in the Vivant would be too much for already dehydrated skin which can be a sign of over-exfoliation anyway.

Molly Cool

Great advice, Molly. I think you're right on the money and it's better to approach cautiously. I think the PSF Pumpkin mask used occasionally, is fine. The key being moderation. I would go w/a lower % Mandelic as Molly mentioned and perhaps use it every other day 1x.

free skin care · Sun Oct 01, 2006 8:33 am

cuppre wrote:

Molly wrote:

Quote:

Would this be too intense for a younger skin?

Hi Cuppre
I was answering Lucinda's Q before that. I assumed as she didn't get a reply that she'd asked your age to see if you were a similar age to her and giving it a go. Just a guess Confused

In answer to your Qs
Mandelic acid is an AHA.
Best to start with 2% salicylic
the rest I don't know about, sorry.

Lol, sorry about the confusion and thanks for being so nice.

I will start with the 2% salicylic acid now, and I am just wondering if there are any differences between various companies' formulas in terms of actual effectiveness of use?

Whee! We're cross posting! The answer is a definite YES. The alcohol and percentage, etc. can all affect the Ph and ultimate strength of the product. Two good vendors I've found arewww.dianayvonne.com and http://www.skincarecentral.biz/skincare-samples.html. The formulations are clean and at the right Ph!

free skin care · Sun Oct 01, 2006 8:45 am

Thank you Lucinda, Molly and scalawaggirl for all the advice. I am learning so much at the moment Very Happy

, especially with all the cross posting!

Just to make sure I understand everything:
1. I can most likely replace my Benzac with the BHA 2% and Mandelic Acid
2. Get a good cleanser. I am just wondering what is a good cleanser. I am currently using the Neutrogena Extra Gentle Cleanser and my skin has no negative reaction to it. Would it be acceptable to continue using it?
3. The mandelic acid should be applied to my troubled spots only because it would be too drying otherwise?

I also see the mention of peels. Is that the main tool for getting rid of patches of flaky skin? I am currently using Alba Papaya Mask and manual exfoliation, but they are not removing a few stubborn patches of flaking skin.

free skin care · Sun Oct 01, 2006 8:58 am

I can understand you wouldn't want scarring Lucinda - that's hard to fix.

I guess you already use BHA, don't you?

You might like the Mandelic at 10% (without alcohol from Skincarecentral) over the ISC Active. Firstly because it's supposed to be better for pigmentation problems than glycolic and secondly it's supposed to be an AHA with BHA (pore cleansing) qualities.

I'd be surprised if you'd got melasma so young though because that tends to appear later in life and it's usually hormonal. Seems unlikely, but I don't know.

free skin care · Sun Oct 01, 2006 9:18 am

cuppre wrote:

Thank you Lucinda, Molly and scalawaggirl for all the advice. I am learning so much at the moment Very Happy

, especially with all the cross posting!

Just to make sure I understand everything:
1. I can most likely replace my Benzac with the BHA 2% and Mandelic Acid

Yes, this should address your needs.

2. Get a good cleanser. I am just wondering what is a good cleanser. I am currently using the Neutrogena Extra Gentle Cleanser and my skin has no negative reaction to it. Would it be acceptable to continue using it?

It depends on the ingredients, any way you can post them? I use Devita Aloe Vera cleanser but it has essential oils that irritate some people. In the AM, I use Zenbiotics cleanser that is "clean". Stupendous. Big fan of this line and it's cheap.

3. The mandelic acid should be applied to my troubled spots only because it would be too drying otherwise?

Not necessarily. You could apply it all over but pay attention to your skin. Do not use anything over the 10% formulation right now as the 15% will probably be way to strong for your skin. You may find that you can only tolerate it every other day, for instance, to avoid drying too much. I think our friend, Molly, does this.

I also see the mention of peels. Is that the main tool for getting rid of patches of flaky skin? I am currently using Alba Papaya Mask and manual exfoliation, but they are not removing a few stubborn patches of flaking skin.

Peels are generally to address specific issues such as hyperpigmentation, wrinkles, scars and so on. I wouldn't generally recommend them as a normal course, if you do not have any of these issues. I really like the PSF Pumpkin Enzyme mask for dealing w/stubborn skin. Others also love Juice Beauty's Apple Peel. I found it did nothing for me but it might be a good choice for you!

free skin care · Tue Oct 03, 2006 4:55 am

I want to incorporate Mandelic acid in my skincare regime as I have large pores around nose and cheek area. Before I run off and order from Skincare Central, I would like to run this through you.

AM
Using Shiseido Benefiance creamy cleansing foam now but will probably change to ISC cleansing complex (open to suggestions)
ISC Super Serum/Cellular Skin RX C + Firming Serum (half face experiment)
Hydracool
Cellcosmet Ultra Eye Complex

PM
Shiseido Benefiance creamy cleasing foam/ISC cleansing complex
Active Serum
Hydracool
Cellcosmet Contour Eye Cream

I plan to use the 10% Mandelic Acid + Ultra Emu Oil + HA? every other night. Can I use the Mandelic Acid and the Active Serum together? When using the Mandelic Acid, I also plan to use the microdermabrasion cream from Skincare Central. Do I need anything else to use with the Mandelic Acid eg Exfol?

I use the PSF Pumpkin Peel once a week.

Thanks.

free skin care · Tue Oct 03, 2006 5:00 am

scalawaggirl wrote:

PM (for 2 weeks - until 10/8; change to 7 drops CP/1 drop water)
· Cleanse w/Devita aloe cleanser (use Clarisonic brush - manual exfoliation)
· BHA 5% all over - rub this in gently with a soft toothbrush to scarred and blackhead-prone problem areas
· Exfol serum around eyes, lips; LacSal lotion on neck, décolletage and hands - WAIT 30 minutes
· CP Serum (6 drops CP/2 drops water) to face, Night Eyes Premier around eyes
· TriReduction on neck/BND on décolletage
· Emu oil w/HA lightly applied all over
· Spot treat scars w/SuperCop 2x
· Katee's Eye potion or Cellcosmet eye cream

Scally

Out of interest, what is Katee's Eye potion.

And thanks for your reply to my earlier question re dilution of CP. Must have missed it before.

Thanks.

free skin care · Tue Oct 03, 2006 6:04 am

Ninetynine wrote:

Out of interest, what is Katee's Eye potion.

http://www.essentialdayspa.com/forum/viewthread.php?tid=15136&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=katees+eye+potion&start=0

free skin care · Tue Oct 03, 2006 6:48 am

Ninetynine wrote:

I want to incorporate Mandelic acid in my skincare regime as I have large pores around nose and cheek area. Before I run off and order from Skincare Central, I would like to run this through you.

AM
Using Shiseido Benefiance creamy cleansing foam now but will probably change to ISC cleansing complex (open to suggestions)
ISC Super Serum/Cellular Skin RX C + Firming Serum (half face experiment)
Hydracool
Cellcosmet Ultra Eye Complex

PM
Shiseido Benefiance creamy cleasing foam/ISC cleansing complex
Active Serum
Hydracool
Cellcosmet Contour Eye Cream

I plan to use the 10% Mandelic Acid + Ultra Emu Oil + HA? every other night. Can I use the Mandelic Acid and the Active Serum together?

Yes, but there would be a wait time between and after because the Ph levels are not the same. I ultimately decided to forego the Active Serum due to all the other actives I incorporate (I use Mandelic in the AM). So, I think you'd need to wait about 20-30 minutes after the Active and then 30 minutes after Mandelic - this is to allow the full exfoliation to occur that happens within the time it takes for the skin's Ph to return to normal. Applying different Ph level products negates the activity of the first applied (if the 2nd is significantly higher). I asked in an earlier thread the Ph of Active Serum for just this reason - could I layer. The tests came back at 3.5 and the Mandelic is around 1.9-2.5 (can't remember exactly) so no layering. However, you could alternate nights as you first noted to save time.

When using the Mandelic Acid, I also plan to use the microdermabrasion cream from Skincare Central. Do I need anything else to use with the Mandelic Acid eg Exfol?

No, not necessarily. Mandelic is an AHA/BHA combo and most of use use it for the pore-tightening/exfoliation qualities (also helps keep pores clean). The micro cream will help with shedding old skin. Exfol is what some people use in lieu of stronger acids like straight BHA or Mandelic due to tolerance. I use it, too, but under my eyes, around my lips (huge improvement in both areas, BTW) and in the AM on my neck.

I use the PSF Pumpkin Peel once a week.

I love this peel; simply love it!

Thanks.

free skin care · Tue Oct 03, 2006 6:50 am

Ninetynine wrote:

Scally

Out of interest, what is Katee's Eye potion.

And thanks for your reply to my earlier question re dilution of CP. Must have missed it before.

Thanks.

Hi, it's a DIY recipe for a night-time eye cream. I really like it but have had a tough time keeping at it due to my routine. Smile

Here's the link:
http://www.essentialdayspa.com/forum/viewthread.php?tid=15136&highlight=katee+eye

free skin care · Sun Oct 08, 2006 10:58 am

I had been using the MaMa lotion once every 6 or 7 days. About 3 weeks ago I upped my usage of the MaMa to once every three days. About a week and a half later I switched to the skincarecentral 10% mandelic and a week ago I started applying the mandelic every other day.

Irritation wise I have been doing pretty good. I did on a few occasions notice some flakiness around my nose and a little dryness in general. But really focusing on hydrating my skin seems to have solved those problems. I do not noticed much stinging when I apply the mandelic and my face rarely seems irritated the day that I use the mandelic. I did have some issues with irritation for a day or so after using the mandelic but I don't really notice this anymore.

My blackheads are almost gone. Very Happy

Now for the bad news. Sad

Most of you know that I don't believe in purging unless there is something to purge . Well I seem to be purging. My acne has gotten a lot worse since I have increased my mandelic usage. All the pimples seem to be occuring on my cheeks and jaw which is where I have a lot of whiteheads. Well I assumed that the pimples were just my whiteheads that were being brought to the surface by the mandelic. Now if this were the case I would think that I should notice less whiteheads. However, I seem to now have more whiteheads than ever!!!

I am not sure what is going on here. Is this purging that will eventually result in better skin and less whiteheads. I mainly started using the mandelic to help with my acne and to get rid of my clogged pores (mainly whiteheads). I worry because when I was using glycolic lotion on regular basis (daily at first but then a few times an week) my acne got much worse. I assumed it was purging but it never stopped and eventually many months later I gave up using the glycolic. I was hoping the the mandelic would be different since it is a large molecule and should be less irritating. But I am wondering if I am going to have the same problems with the mandelic that I had with the glycolic. Offhand I would say that it does not appear to be irritating my skin like the glycolic did so maybe it is different. I just don't know.

I also wonder if I am using the mandelic enough for it to really be effective against my acne. I recall reading that it has to be used at least every other day to achieve benefits. Does anyone know anything about this?

The only other thing that I changed in my routine is my C serum. I switched from the Proheal to the ISC 15% Vitamin C. Is it possible that this is the cause of my problems? I suppose that the retinol in the Proheal could have been helping with my acne and whiteheads and stopping it resulted in them getting worse. But I did not have the problem before I started the Proheal. I also find the regular C serum a little drying so that may be part of the problem too. I sometimes wonder if it may be best to go with a gentler c serum since I have read too many times to ignore it that high strenght ascorbic acid C serums tend to make acne worse. I can even recall reading on the forum that other members have gotten whiteheads from using C serums.

Let me know what you think. Has anyone else experienced anything similar from mandelic or C serums? Am I just being impatient. My rational mind says to stick with the mandelic and give it a chance and to switch C serums. But I am soooo tired of getting more and more pimples and whiteheads. Mad

free skin care · Sun Oct 08, 2006 11:14 am

TheresaL, up to until reading that you changed C serums at the same time, I thought you might be having an irritation reaction to the Mandelic acid; however, once I read that you had switched that, as well, I think it may be the culprit.

As for purging, I believe that happens in about 3 weeks or so. Anything before that is a reaction/sensitivity to an ingredient or combination of ingredients and continued use just repeats the irritated cycle making it appear to be purging (as in the case of your glycolic experience).

Now, it may seem easy to say that the Vit. C is the problem but I have often heard of people breaking out with C serum formulations. What I'd recommend is going back to Proheal (if you can and have some on hand) and then test the mandelic against that. If you don't have any, take that factor out. This way, you can determine if it is indeed the mandelic (could also be the formulation that doesn't agree with you).

As for the timing, everything I've researched indicates that yes, you do need to use Mandelic once every other day (atleast) to receive benefits.

free skin care · Sun Oct 08, 2006 12:01 pm

Theresa and scalawaggirl,

When I first started to read Theresa's post, I also thought irritation, especially because glycolic is not known to purge, at least not that I have ever heard of.

I have actually never heard of strong Cs causing acne. I have a very acne/blackhead prone chin and I have no problem using Vit C serums on it. BUT the problem may be what kind. Some of these (including IS) have ingredients that can clog pores or cause acne.

I read on skincarerx.com that the high levels of zinc used in the Cellex C and Skinceuticals formula can acutally cause acne (although zinc in general is good for acne--I case it's a case of too much).

I bought the IS once and I remember it had stuff in it that scared me off of putting it anywhere near my chin.

I think scalawaggirl has a good solution for you to try out. Very Happy

I do know there is nothing in the mandelic you got from me that would clog pores. I made sure of that when I had it formulated. That doesn't mean it just doesn't agree with you, of course!

If the mandelic does not work, have you ever tried salicylic acid? For me, that works better than mandelic on blackheads, but it doesn't have the other benefits of mandelic, of course.

HTH,
Kathleen

free skin care · Sun Oct 08, 2006 2:48 pm

Scalawag and Kathleen I am pretty much decided that I will stop using the C serum (if my rational side wins out I will actually only stop using the C serum on half my face but I am a little impatient here) but continue with the mandelic.

It may be purging since it did start about three weeks after starting the mandelic but then again it could be a bad reaction to either the C or the mandelic.

Other than the possibility of zinc that Kathleen mentioned I do not believe that the ISC 15% C has any pore clogging ingredients. But it does have zinc. The Proheal also had zinc, in fact I think that the Proheal has more zinc than any other ISC C serum. I refuse to go back to the Proheal because I think it is part of the reason that I have clogged pores in the first place since it contains laureth-4 which is considered to be very pore clogging! I agree with Kathleen that her mandelic does not contain any pore clogging ingredeints.

Kathleen about C serums causing acne. I have read that the C serums with a higher percentage of ascorbic acid can cause problems for acne prone individuals. The way I understand it is that all C serums with ascorbic acid at an appropriate pH create a mild exfoliation. The more C the more exfoliation. For some reason that I don't know, it is said that the exfoliation that results from these C serums is bad for acne. If you look at Skinceuticles and Cellex-C they actually recommend their lower percentage C serums for acne prone individuals. I have gotten numerous recommendations on c serums and was generally told that the lower strenght ones would be better for me because of my sensitive skin and because I am acne prone. So I think that there may be something to the concern about higher strenght C serums causing acne (at least in those of us with sensitive skin).

I know that you said that glycolic is not known to cause purging but what about mandelic? On the salicylic that is not an option. For some odd reason SA really irritates my skin even at low percentages!

Let me provide some more information. This is the thrid October in a row where I have experienced a worsening of my acne. Although in past years it was mostly focused on my acne and my pores were perfectly fine, no blackheads and only a few whiteheads. I have a hunch that this has something to do with the change in humidity. Sometime in the latter half of September the weather changes from humid (summer monsoon season) to very dry (typical desert weather). This year I have been doing my best to keep my skin hydrated but maybe the drastic change is causing some of my problems. I may be worsening it by using a drying C serum and also using the mandelic acid which is somewhat drying (I couldn't imagine how bad it might be if I tried the Vivant with it's high alcohol content). Let me know what you think on this one and on any points that I raised!

free skin care · Sun Oct 08, 2006 3:19 pm

Hi Theresa,

On the Vit C, that is interesting. I don't buy it that exfoliation would be causing the acne because exfoliation is generally good for acne. BUT perhaps the irritation level of these higher vitamin C products is what causes some folks to break out from them.

So skincarerex.com explanation of why to use lower potency Vit C seems correct--but for the wrong reason!

Definitely don't go back to proheal if the laureth 4 is breaking you out, that's for sure.

To be perfectly honest, I've not familiar with acids causing purging. This is something usually experienced with retinoids/retinol as it pushes the material up out of your pores. Mandelic and salicylic acid both eat away the gunk in the pores, so it seems unlikely they would cause purging. They also exfoliate, of course, and I have had the experience of apply strong (like 10%) salicylic acid to a very huge whitehead about ready to bust and by exfoliating all the skin off the top of it, it came to the surface and turned into a zit instead of just popping out.

I believe it is the act of pushing the junk to the surface that causes breakouts, whereas with acids, you are breaking through the dead skin until, eventually, I suppose you could get to some underlying clogged pores that would have ultimately turned into zits. But by eliminating all that dead skin over them, it doesn't seem they would be trapped--which is how a zit forms.

But feel free to correct me on any of this! In fact, you have me really curious and I am going to see if I can research this a bit and see if anyone purges on acids.

That is interesting as to your acne worsening in October! It seems (at first blush), that a drier climate would make one less likely to break out as oily skin is obviously more acne-prone. But dry skin is definitely prone to whiteheads (because the dead skin prevents the oil from properly leaving the pore) and this may in fact be the cause of your acne, since you say you have most pimples on your cheeks where the whiteheads are. And cheeks tend to the dries part of the face.

But the solution to this problem is usually exfoliation--but apparently they are causing you more grief! So I'm at a loss to suggest what you should do except perhaps try en ever GENTLER acid, such as the 5% lactic acid. That shouldn't irritate anyone, I would think and it's just water and lactic acid.

Another option is to skip acids and just go for manual exfoliation. I have guaze pads and microdermabrasion cream, but those might be too irritating for you, too. You might want to try to get an enzyme peel or Cellex C's Speed Peel. That stuff ROCKS and truly exfoliates.

Is there a possibility that when the weather changes you use moisutrizers that break you out? Even the BHOs CAN break you out. Or does something happen in your life every year around this time (holidays, etc.) that causes stress and the flare-ups? I can't imagine your female hormones just decide to go out of whack every October. Wink

I don't know if this helped...

Kathleen

free skin care · Sun Oct 08, 2006 3:24 pm

keickholt13 wrote:

I do know there is nothing in the mandelic you got from me that would clog pores. I made sure of that when I had it formulated.

Kathleen,

What would happen if I put a few drops of essential oil in your 15% Mandelic Acid? I like it so far, but not the smell, and usually hold my breath when putting it on. Strong smells at 6:30 aren't so fun for me....=), but I don't want to change its effectiveness by adding something.

free skin care · Sun Oct 08, 2006 6:55 pm

Kathleen,

Actually what you have been saying has been very helpful.

I agree that the thing about Vitamin C exfoliation causing acne always struck me as odd too. I think you have it right when you say it is the irritation that may cause breakouts. I think that this may apply to exfoliation in general. I have always suspected that my problem is not with exfoliation but with the fact that it is hard to exfoliate my sensitive skin without causing irritation. So I think that my skin generally responds to exfoliation with acne because of the irritation. I also think that dehydration is part of the problem too. This may be another reason why exfoliating causes my acne to worsen. It's not so much the exfoliation as the dehydration. It does seem odd that I almost never get pimples on my oily areas but get just about all of them on the dry areas. I also don't have whiteheads on my oily areas, just the dry areas!

So the secret lies in finding a way to exfoliate without irritating or overdrying my skin. And I guess on the C serums I need to find one that will not irritate my skin and that is in a base that is not drying. I think it is probably best to get the exfoliating worked out first and then attempt to find a C serum. Do you think I should stick with the mandelic a little longer since I am not going to be using the C serum right now or do you think that it is best to try something else? I am sort of keen on the mandelic because it is antibacterial and it not only is an AHA but it is and AHA that can get into the pores like a BHA. But being keen on something in because of the theory behind it does not mean that my skin will like it. Maybe I should give it a little longer.

On the other options you mentioned. The lactic may be worth a try. I actually seem to do okay with enzyme peels. I have used several different pumpkin peels in the past and have also used products like Kanebo Silk Peeling Powder (which uses enzymes not grains to exfoliate) without any problems. I guess I have never really used any of the enzyme exfoliators consistently enough to see if they work or to see if they cause irritation. Although my understanding is that they are supposed to be better tolertated by sensitive skin types. Manual exfoliation-Yikes!!! That is the worst for my acne. The harshest thing I use on my face is a muslin cloth. Translation- I don't use anything harsh on my face! I may have to take a look at the Cellex C speed peel. I also have some of the Actifirm Enzyme Peel that I bought but haven't tried yet.

What are your thoughts on occasional fruit acid peels instead of regular use of AHAs? I only ask this because until May I was getting 70% glycolic acid peels at my derms. I worked up to the 70% gradually but my skin seems to tolerate once a month peeling quite well. One advantage to the occasional peels is that you are really only going in once in a while and interupting the skin barrier and dehydrating the skin. I have been considering doing home peels and working up to using a reasonable strenght peel (haven't decided on this yet but much less than 70% is my definition of reasonable) maybe once a month or so. I only gave up the peels because of concerns about over exfoliating. Vague thoughts of the Hayflick limit always cross my mind when I think of peels, even though it is not a proven theory. So I am still a little undecided about peels but have really been looking at them as an option since my whiteheads have been so bad lately.

About purging and acids.... I plan on researching this too. I had for some reason accepted it as fact that acids cause purging like retinoids or like benzoyl peroxide but after reading your explanation as to why this shouldn't be so I started wondering what facts I had to support my belief and guess what I don't have any. The purging/acid thing was just something that I assumed. Is there a connection? I don't know. But I am sure one of us will find out! Wink

BTW I looked at my pores tonight after I washed my face and aside from the pimples and whiteheads my pores are pristine! I couldn't even find a blackhead.

Tue Oct 10, 2006 5:21 pm

Okay, this is my third post, but I just thought I'd put in my two cents on mandelic acid since I used it for some time.

I used the NuCelle 10% Mandelic Acid for about 2 months. I just stopped recently (about two weeks ago) because my skin is so messed up. It's not entirely because of the MA, but more me continually putting harsh stuff on my face (derm prescriptions like a retinoid + benzoly peroxide and clinamycin, all at once! geez!). Anyways yeah, this combination destroyed my skin and gave me rosacea, and I'm only 16 for goodness' sake! My skin was red and painful and very messed up for a while there until I stopped using all these products. I can't believe my derm gave them to me. I wanted something gentler, so after my skin calmed down a little, I opted for the MA. Ehh, didn't do much, honestly. I gave it two months, and my redness was still there and I continued to break out just as I had before. After giving up on that, I've just been using Mir cleanser and absolutely nothing else on my skin, and getting the same amount if not less break outs than when I was using the MA.

So, that's my experience. While it's supposed to be one of the more 'gentle' acids, it wasn't gentle enough for my now super-sensitive skin. I want my old skin back =(

I can see how this would work for more mature skin, though! But just not for me.

free skin care · Tue Oct 10, 2006 5:32 pm

Hi Bebeblondie

Welcome to the forum.

I agree with you entirely. What the hell did a doctor think they were doing prescribing all those things at once and for a 16 year old!!! That's complete madness Mad

I really wouldn't recommend any acids at that age.
I think you're right to drop all of it including the MA. I hope you recover quickly from this. You should be able to because you're young.

Have you found something gentle to repair your skin?

Good luck, Molly Smile

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