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Sat Jul 01, 2006 6:26 pm  |
Last night, I had an asthma attack during the night - the worst I've ever had since I developed the condition about 5 years ago. I‘ve been medication-free for the past 2 years.
(Not to get too philosophical here, but when you can't breathe, it really puts things in perspective...)
I've been using a sample of the Vivier vit C serum 10 for about 3 weeks. The first couple of weeks I used it about 2x a week, but this week I used it 3 out of 4 days. A couple of times - including last night - I also put a drop on my lower lip.
I'm wondering if the propylene glycol in the Vivier might be the cause of my attack. (I'm not picking on Vivier – it happens to be the one I use – and had been thinking about buying a full size of. I know other C serums also have PG.)
I recall reading somewhere that propylene glycol is related to asthma problems - does anyone know? Anyone else have any kind of reaction to PG? |
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Sat Jul 01, 2006 9:14 pm |
I think you're on to the cause, but keep your eye on everything. It's really amazing the things that can trigger asthma... and I find that the triggers change as we age. Lately, I've been noticing increased wheezing with juices, alcohol, and bleach. Never happened before. And now I can drink milk and eat ice cream with no problems, when they were like poison to my asthma as a child.
Good luck and take care of yourself. |
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36, skin in a "new" phase? Oil/break-out free but now having bouts of sensitivity and surface dehydration. |
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Sat Jul 01, 2006 10:15 pm |
Candy, thanks for the links.  I haven't been able to find anything specific to asthma, but here's another one that talks about PG and allergies
http://www.ewg.org/reports/skindeep2/report.php?type=INGREDIENT&id=615
LandB, yes will keep an eye out for other possible triggers. Do you take medication? for the past couple of years I have been using breathing exercises only to keep it under control. After this though, I thinking about making sure I have a puffer handy.
I appreciate your caring and concern. You take care, also. |
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Sun Jul 02, 2006 2:36 am |
| montrealgal wrote: |
LandB, yes will keep an eye out for other possible triggers. Do you take medication? for the past couple of years I have been using breathing exercises only to keep it under control. After this though, I thinking about making sure I have a puffer handy.
I appreciate your caring and concern. You take care, also. |
I have an inhaler handy but do not take any preventative medication. I only need the inhaler when I have a bad chest cold or when I stumble on a trigger. I try a hot shower and a cup of coffee first, if I'm at home. Sometimes the heat and steam are enough.
That said, I just remembered another odd trigger - the stuff used to unclog drains. This chemical caused my only emergency medical visit since I was a child. I barely made it to the hospital lobby and should have called 911. I hadn't bothered to refill my inhaler prescription because I was doing so well for so long, and it was too bad of an attack to try a shower or coffee. EEKS!
So, please please please drop an inhaler in your purse. Worth the peace of mind! |
_________________
36, skin in a "new" phase? Oil/break-out free but now having bouts of sensitivity and surface dehydration. |
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Sun Jul 02, 2006 5:38 am |
| That happened to me when I used Hydroquinone. I was on the obagi and everything was going well, but then I stepped up and started to add the clear in the morning, as well as the blender at night (both contain HQ) and I had a bad asthma attack. |
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Sun Jul 02, 2006 6:41 am |
montrealgal - I'd no idea that propylene glycol could do this. Worth watching out for.
Mind you, like LandB says, it's amazing how things can suddenly start affecting your asthma.
I don't know what other ingredients are in the Vivier Vitamin C Serum, but is there any salicylic acid or anti-inflammatory stuff?
Attacks are pretty scary, I know. Hope you're feeling much better today, poor thing. |
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Mon Jul 03, 2006 1:45 pm |
| LandB wrote: |
I have an inhaler handy but do not take any preventative medication. I only need the inhaler when I have a bad chest cold or when I stumble on a trigger. I try a hot shower and a cup of coffee first, if I'm at home. Sometimes the heat and steam are enough.
That said, I just remembered another odd trigger - the stuff used to unclog drains. This chemical caused my only emergency medical visit since I was a child. I barely made it to the hospital lobby and should have called 911. I hadn't bothered to refill my inhaler prescription because I was doing so well for so long, and it was too bad of an attack to try a shower or coffee. EEKS!
So, please please please drop an inhaler in your purse. Worth the peace of mind! |
Wow, that incident with the drain cleaner sounds scary, LandB.
I haven't heard about showers and coffee as a remedy. Do you actually need to step in the shower, or would just turning it on and shutting the bathroom door do it?
Drinking coffee helps? I don't drink it because of the caffeine -- is it the caffeine that's suppose to help? Would tea have the same results?
Yes, I think I'll have to cave and keep an inhaler handy. Ironically, I just saw my respirologist 2 weeks ago and told him I didn't want any meds or inhalers and would just do breathing exercises. Like you, it had been a long time since I'd had an attack. |
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Mon Jul 03, 2006 2:01 pm |
rileygirl -- i did not know that about HQ. Thanks for the heads up. Now I'm thinking there should be some special warning on makeup and skincare products for us asthma sufferers!
majorb, i read there were some concerns about PG re: asthma some time ago, but i guess becaue i've had no real problems with my asthma for so long, it didn't register. i did a web search Saturday and couldn't find the info directly linking pg and asthma, just that it is a problem for allergy sufferers.
Yes, I'll have to pay attention to other possible triggers.
I'm not sure what else is in the Vivier C serum. I'll let you know if I find out.
I am feeling better, thanks, though not the way I felt before this last attack. But better is good, and I'm not complaining |
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Mon Jul 03, 2006 3:04 pm |
I always, always keep an inhaler with me. Might be a good idea for you to do the same - just a little insurance and peace of mind.
There's also a device that fits over your nose and mouth, and your inhaler fits into the other end. When you puff the inhaler into the device, you inhale the medication into your airways more effectively. It used to be called a Volumatic, but I can't remember the name of the newer one. Unfortunately, it's not terribly portable, but is great to keep at home (or take on holiday) for when you have an attack. It also helps daily medication get into your system more easily. |
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Mon Jul 03, 2006 3:46 pm |
| montrealgal wrote: |
[I haven't heard about showers and coffee as a remedy. Do you actually need to step in the shower, or would just turning it on and shutting the bathroom door do it?
Drinking coffee helps? I don't drink it because of the caffeine -- is it the caffeine that's suppose to help? Would tea have the same results? |
I read about both of these home remedies somewhere along the way....just can't recall when or where.
I don't necessarily think you need to be in the shower itself - the steam alone might work. I just dive right in because aside from the steam opening my airway, showers are very relaxing for me and I think that helps keep me calm to focus on breathing.
As for coffee, I do think it's the caffiene ... something about the stimulant effect helps me breathe better... and the steam helps too. So I think caffeinated tea would work equally well.
But let's hope you need neither for a long time!  |
_________________
36, skin in a "new" phase? Oil/break-out free but now having bouts of sensitivity and surface dehydration. |
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Mon Jul 03, 2006 4:33 pm |
Hi LandB,
It's all so confusing. I did a google search with the words: asthma attacks + showers + caffeine
I found some sites that said yes, showers help (the ones I read said it is the steam, so you just have to close the bathroom door -- like you said ). At least one person said showers make it worse. Another person said caffeine made her (his?) asthma worse.
But one site had 8 posts where readers said ACV helped their asthma!
Well, I was planning to pick some up to try to make my own vit c serum, so another reason to buy!
Yes, let's hoping none of us discussing it here need to deal with another asthma attack for a looong time |
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Mon Jul 03, 2006 8:15 pm |
| Hot coffee helps my asthma attacks, but the steam makes mine way worse. I have trouble here in FL because it is so humid in the summer, which is when my asthma is at its worst! |
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Tue Jul 04, 2006 5:19 am |
| montrealgal wrote: |
| But one site had 8 posts where readers said ACV helped their asthma! |
Wow! Okay... might be a stupid question... but how did they use it? I hope topically or smelling it... don't see myself making an ACV cocktail anytime soon!  |
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36, skin in a "new" phase? Oil/break-out free but now having bouts of sensitivity and surface dehydration. |
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Tue Jul 04, 2006 8:18 am |
| Quote: |
| don't see myself making an ACV cocktail anytime soon! |
but you should LandB. It's extremely healthy to drink good quality vinegar and superb in hot weather. |
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Tue Jul 04, 2006 9:07 am |
LandB, Molly
Yes, they talked about taking it internally. Can't remember how much. Some mixed it with honey
SusieQ -- I agree there's a lot of misinformation out there, and also that everyone reacts differently. Went to the link you gave and Paula Begoun wrote this:
"PEGs have no known skin toxicity. The only negative research results for this ingredient group indicate that large quantities given orally to rats can cause tumors. How that got related to skin-care products is a mystery to me."
Not exactly a ringing endorsement to me 
I have seen sites that I think are reliable that talk about problems with PG. Will post the links when I get a chance
rileygirl -- it's amazing, isn't it, how different remedies work for different people? Keep drinking that java - and stay out of the shower I guess |
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Tue Jul 04, 2006 12:48 pm |
Paula B is talking about huge quantities of PEGs. The minute amount put into cosmetics today is nothing to be worried about. We don't ingest cosmetics and the molecules are too big for them to enter the bloodstream. (Thats a myth too). Lets just give up living altogether.
I would like to see these links, when you get a chance. |
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Wed Jul 05, 2006 1:11 pm |
| SusieQ wrote: |
Paula B is talking about huge quantities of PEGs. The minute amount put into cosmetics today is nothing to be worried about. We don't ingest cosmetics and the molecules are too big for them to enter the bloodstream. (Thats a myth too). Lets just give up living altogether.
I would like to see these links, when you get a chance. |
I just noticed that you and Paula B are talking about PEGs. I, and some others here, were discussing PG -- propylene glycol. So I'm wondering if we are talking about apples and oranges -- or at least lemons and limes?
I must confessed that I am *science-challenged*. SusieQ, you sound like you have a strong science background, so maybe you can answer some questions for me. At the risk of exposing my ignorance to everyone who may read this, here goes:
Is ingesting the only way chemicals, nutrients, etc. can get into our bloodstream? If *stuff* can be absorbed through our skin, doesn't the stuff from our skin/tissues enter the bloodstream? I guess from what you're saying about molecule size, the answer to that last question would be 'it depends'. So how can we -- the average person (not scientist) know? In my case, I am thinking putting the serum with the PG directly on my lips (as well as the rest of my face and neck)before going to bed is what made my reaction so severe...
If you -- or anyone else -- can clarify this, please do!
[Because the post got too long, I'm listing links in a separate post. See part 2 below ] |
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Wed Jul 05, 2006 1:13 pm |
Part 2 (from above)
SusieQ and anyone else interested, here are some links I found that discuss PG (and other ingredients) that reportedly have side effects, are dangerous, etc.
This first one lists "Common Hazardous Ingredients in Personal Care Products". the site is run by he Environmental Health Association of Nova Scotia (EHANS) and also discusses household cleaners, baby care, pest control, etc. :
http://www.lesstoxicguide.ca/index.asp?fetch=personal
This one is run by Environmental Working Group. You can get info on both specific ingredients and specific products by brandname:
http://www.ewg.org/reports/skindeep2/search.php?search=propylene+glycol&searchtype=ingredients&Go.x=16&Go.y=15
There's also some info here -- didn't look at this closely -- I was going cross-eyed trying to read their on-line pocket guide . It the site of the National Institute for Occupational Health and Safety, which apparently is a division of the CDC/Centers for Disease Control:
http://www.cdc.gov/niosh/homepage.html
This one is from the Toxicology Data Network, which appears to be a branch of the US National Library of Medicine:
http://toxnet.nlm.nih.gov/cgi-bin/sis/search/f?./temp/~eUIdTU:1
Now, having posted all that I want to say that some people can have sensitivities, etc. that may not yet be supported by data, and just because the data doesn't exist yet, doesn't mean it ain't so. For example, it took a long time for MCS - multiple chemical sensitivity -- to be recognized and still some people, doctors and scientists included, don't believe there's such a thing. There are many, many examples where ailments and conditions, etc. have been dismissed and then later found to have foundation. Sometimes it takes years before the facts are there. In the meantime, people suffer and die.
Personally, I will take anecdotal *evidence* over the *facts* anyday.
(To those who've read this far, thanks for sticking with me  ) |
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Wed Jul 05, 2006 1:58 pm |
| I know that anti-inflammatory drugs in pain-relieving gels applied on my skin can cause me to have an asthma attack. Also, I have a similar problem with salicylic acid. |
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Wed Jul 05, 2006 5:47 pm |
| majorb wrote: |
| I know that anti-inflammatory drugs in pain-relieving gels applied on my skin can cause me to have an asthma attack. Also, I have a similar problem with salicylic acid. |
Salicylic acid is the stuff in asprin, right? What kinds of skincare or make-up products might they be in?
I'll have to pay attention to this to see if they are posible triggers for my asthma.
Thanks, majorb |
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Thu Jul 06, 2006 2:27 am |
Unfortunately, salicylic acid is in loads and loads of stuff. I believe it has exfoliant properties, too. (May be wrong there, though.)
Although I always try to check, occasionally I forget and buy something with it. Sometimes I get lucky (possibly because a product contains only a very tiny amount) and it doesn't set off my asthma, but usually it starts me off wheezing. |
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Thu Jul 06, 2006 11:00 pm |
| majorb wrote: |
| Unfortunately, salicylic acid is in loads and loads of stuff. I believe it has exfoliant properties, too. (May be wrong there, though.) |
I'm going to have to make a habit of reading the ingredients lists more, just to be aware if I do have a reaction.
| Quote: |
Although I always try to check, occasionally I forget and buy something with it. Sometimes I get lucky (possibly because a product contains only a very tiny amount) and it doesn't set off my asthma, but usually it starts me off wheezing. |
I know what you mean, majorb -- it's hard to keep track. And there are so many unknowns. I was trying out a new product the last couple of nights and ended up having another attack. This one was minor compared to the last one. But I looked over the list of ingredients -- mostly checking for PG. There wasn't any, but I wasn't familiar with most of the ingredients listed. I have no idea which - if any - of them was the trigger  |
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Thu Jul 06, 2006 11:09 pm |
Oh - I finally got an inhaler again. Just filled the Rx tonight.
Definely helps with peace of mind, as LandB and majorb said
| majorb wrote: |
There's also a device that fits over your nose and mouth, and your inhaler fits into the other end. When you puff the inhaler into the device, you inhale the medication into your airways more effectively. It used to be called a Volumatic, but I can't remember the name of the newer one. Unfortunately, it's not terribly portable, but is great to keep at home (or take on holiday) for when you have an attack. It also helps daily medication get into your system more easily. |
Yes, I forgot to respond when you first posted this. I have one of these and dug it out when I read your post. The one I have is called an Aerochamber. I had to ask the pharmacist to explain how to use it again -- it's been so long |
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