Would you marry a man...
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free skin care · Sat May 30, 2009 3:28 pm

who you loved and really loved you, made you feel special, was smart, and you enjoyed each other's company if he was:
-super messy, to the point of not being able to invite people into his home because it would be an embaressment?
Even if he promised not to do that when married, it has been his life long pattern so I know that he won't change long term. That means I will be doing a lot more cleaning, picking up, etc.
He also has children (I do too). I feel like my life is really hectic and although he says we will be sharing responsibilities when married, he manages to do very little house stuff (works long days) so that means I will be doing more of the cooking, cleaning, etc., and realistically he will not.

Will having to feed/clean up after his kids build resentment? I also work but cannot live in a really messy place so I would end up picking up more.

I do love this man dearly and he is a kind hearted, honest man but I have never met anyone who is so slow at getting things done and oblivious to whether or not things around him are neat or messy.

Is this a receipe for disaster? Can this really work?

free skin care · Sat May 30, 2009 6:17 pm

If this messy lifestyle bothers you enough to post to this board then it must be an issue of prime importance.

How messy is he? Is he messy as in tosses clothes everywhere but in the hamper or is he messy as in leaving dirty plates/glasses etc. everywhere? If he does both of these things then look at his car. How bad is it? Does he drop wet towels on the floor? Does he put empty cereal boxes in the trash or does he leave them on the counter/table? Does he change the toilet paper roll? Does he take out the trash? Can he tell his clean clothes from his dirty clothes? Can you see the floors? Tabletops? Will you need to share a bathroom together? How does his bathroom look? Could you stand him leaving his stuff everywhere?

His children would have learned to repeat these messy behaviors and won't understand why you will be so anal. They will most likely resist in rebellious ways.

Do you or will you have pets that also need taking care of?

free skin care · Sat May 30, 2009 6:19 pm

Hi Lily:

I think it could work if he agreed to get rid of some of the clutter. Is he necessarily emotionally fond of the junk or just does not clean ? What constitutes clutter in your mind and his might be two different things.

You would probably have to agree to accept a lot more mess, and not complain about it. Also more importantly, I would think you would need to lose the embarrassment as that means you care more about what others think then what your new husband is like. You said he prob would not change. If you are ashamed of him or his ways, then that would not make a healthy marriage.

My advice (definitely being on the messy side) is that 'organization' is not my skill set. I have great skills, but just not in the 'neat and organized' area. I would expect my spouse (if he cared alot about 'organization') to accept me, or pick up the slack, or hire it out. But quite frankly, I will not change much. It is like trying to turn someone into a gourmet cook, it cannot happen unless they really want to. I am just not motivated in that area. But I love a clean house and would find it GREAT if someone handled that area for me. Just like someone who is not a gourmet cook, probably still loves gourmet meals !

I have had a husband (we are now seperated) who bitched at me for years, every day, constantly, incessantly, about the home. I dreaded his coming home from work because it meant I would get scorned at, immediately. He cared more about the home, then about me. I am not saying you would be like this but - I think you need to care more about your husband then the home. I believe this is hard to do ! I bet your new husband would just love to get rid of the mess. I actually HATE mess, I just am not going to spend the time cleaning it up constantly. That is why I have decided to throw half of what I own away, or give it away. I could care less, I just want it out of my home.

good luck, don't make him or yourself miserable. It sounds like you are being very smart and thoughtful by asking the question in the first place.

free skin care · Sat May 30, 2009 7:08 pm

Thanks.

You both have very good/helpful responses.

Messy as in Christmas tree stays up until March, clothes are not all over but laundry is piled high in laundry room, dishes eventually get done and there are no bugs or maggets, and he does take out the garbage. Food that doesn't need to be in the refrigerator gets left out though and although the Christmas tree is gone the box of ornamnets is still in the living room. He does not eat outside of the kitchen so there are no dishes or food left anywhere else but in the kitchen.

Empty cereal boxes could stay on the counter for a while before being put in the trash. He does hang wet towels up.

Once his clothes are washed he puts them away neatly.

The bathroom is actually one of the neater rooms in the house. He does change the toilet paper roll.

A lot of the mess is bills/paperwork that is 2 feet high on his kitchen counter and kitchen table. He does have file cabinets that are full of stuff and then closets full of stuff (paperwork) stuff as well. Stuff for work, magazines, personal documents. He has personal letters/documents from 30 years ago in boxes.

So in general, you can see the floors fine but the counters are covered with papers, paperwork, mail, bills.

His car is actually not that bad. He keeps some stuff in the trunk but it is close to as neat as mine is.

His yard is a disaster. In terms of his kids, one is a normal messy type, the other is a total neat freak.

I don't want to complain about it and will not get married if I don't think I can do this.

The problem is that while I am not a total clean/neat freak, I do not like clutter and I am a type A personality which means that I naturally do something quickly and efficiently when I see it needs doing. It is important to me to have the dishes done after each meal, before going to bed, etc., and I have a hard time relaxing unless that is done.

I am not "ashamed" of him per say but cannot live in the clutter/mess that he can- even if no one else sees it but me. It is so interesting because I don't even think he sees the mess or sees it but it doesn't bother him. I am not like that and my worry is about whether or not I will get resentful over the years of doing more of that than him?

I am not a nagging type of person so don't see me doing that, but I could get resentful. He is more relaxed than I am, able to do fun things while his house is a mess and not give it a second thought. I cannot and while I intellectually know that going for a walk while the sun is out may be more important than getting the dishes done, I can't relax if they are not done because I know they will be waiting for me when I get back.

We are going to hire a house cleaner so I won't need to worry about that part but they don't do dishes or tidy.

Maybe I am a bit nervous about getting married and am looking at anything that could be a potential problem. It is the 2nd marriage for both of us (my first was short and a total disaster).

I can see that with more kids around that there will be more that needs tidying from them but it is wrong for me to expect a grown man to look after his stuff? It is hard for me to understand it since I think that if you put things back right away where they belong you save time (by not having to clean up later) and keep things neat.

Even though my finace says that he will not be messy at my place (we have been dating 2 years and he is over at my place 2-3 times per week and so far has never been messy here and this is where we will live) I am not naive and I know that that is just the way he is- he always has been.

What I don't hear you saying is "run for your life, it will never work" so that is good.

I think my finace would also prefer to live in an organized home but we both work, both have children, the real question is will I get resentful after a certain period of time and how do I not get resentful? He says that when we are married it will be easier for both of us because we can share responsibilities but in reality, I think it will be easier for HIM but I think I will have more to do!

free skin care · Sat May 30, 2009 7:27 pm

Eeek! Sounds like you'll be doing hard time, minus the orange jumpsuit... Shock

(On 2nd thought, he just might have one stashed for ya, among the debris.. Bad Grin

)

Okay, now all kidding aside, If you really love this guy (and his kids), and you are going in with both eyes open knowing that you will be doing most of the *fun stuff*, then go for it...

Just keep in mind, that this could be his best foot forward, and he might be even worse, when he knows you'll pick up after him..

free skin care · Sat May 30, 2009 8:06 pm

Honey, that is my DH to a T!

Papers pile up, mail sits, journals from 1985 he still has in HIS room! It is key that he have his own room. That way he can have his stuff and you don't have to see it!

I say as long as the kitchen and bathrooms are clean, you can see the floors (and not stick to them), and there are no vermin......good enough!

Have a happy life together and enjoy yourselves. A tidy house is overrated. It should be clean however. That's where the cleaning lady comes in...lucky you he agrees to it!!

free skin care · Sat May 30, 2009 8:55 pm

We have role reversal in our household. DH is the neat, orderly one, and I am the messy one.

I remember when I first went to his apartment, I thought, how great! This man can take care of himself. And then I realized that when he saw my place, he would run away screaming. My heart sank, and I thought, oh, this will never work.

Well, he eventually moved in with me, and we are still happily married, six years later. He is so accepting, and he truly shows his love for me by doing his best to help.

free skin care · Sat May 30, 2009 10:59 pm

LuvToSmile wrote:

I actually HATE mess, I just am not going to spend the time cleaning it up constantly. That is why I have decided to throw half of what I own away, or give it away. I could care less, I just want it out of my home.

OMG...you must be my twin and we were separated at birth! Shock

I just completely lack the desire/ambition to make cleaning a priority...I have far more appealing things to do (like wasting time on this forum). But I am beginning "The Big Purge" because I plan on moving in 9-12 months and I am starting to clean out crap NOW! The less I have, the less to clean now, and the less to move later!

free skin care · Sun May 31, 2009 6:41 am

Hmmm...this is really very interesting for me. My finace is not lazy and is busy doing other things just does not make keeping things tidy and organized a priority.

I know that when we live together I am going to need to have a lot more storage space than I do now. I am planning to get some units from Ikea so there is lots of storage space. He will also have his own "office" so I don't care if that is messy (I'll just close the door).

I have just never met anyone like that before- everyone else I have dated and girlfriends I have roomed with, were not like that. My ex-husband was neat on his own but then when we were married expected me to do everything and left stuff all over which I did not like (sort of like he fooled me). With my fiance, he is not pretending to be neat/tidy nor does he think it would be my job to tidy up after him.

free skin care · Sun May 31, 2009 8:34 am

lily wrote:

With my fiance, he is not pretending to be neat/tidy nor does he think it would be my job to tidy up after him.

The point you don't want to miss is that he is very comfortable in that environment. If he was uncomfortable or embarrassed, he never would have let you in the place until he thoroughly cleaned.

No matter what he tells you now, you HAVE seen the REAL him...you are not going to change him, his tidiness intentions may not come to fruition (or will grow increasingly lax over time), and nagging will not be good on the relationship (and neither will any resentment you may foster over time if you take on more).

Your options will come down to how YOU will deal with it. If you want to live together (married or not), you could:
- Establish his "Man Zone" which is free from nagging or cleanliness requirements
- Jointly establish a few reasonable expectations/tasks (too many and he may not want to marry you, lol)
- Plan a couple of cleaning times for an hour a couple of nights during the week, and a few hours on the weekend...you are both cleaning, so that may get him to want to help you so that you can both do something fun later
- Hire someone to do the bulk of what he won't/can't due
- Willingly pick up the rest of the tasks yourself because it may be a small price to pay to be with someone you really love

OR:
- Maintain separate living quarters until he proves that he can keep his place cleaner

OR:
- Find a neater man

free skin care · Sun May 31, 2009 8:51 am

Thanks to Kassy for the laugh of the day!!!!

Kassy_A wrote:

Eeek! Sounds like you'll be doing hard time, minus the orange jumpsuit... Shock

(On 2nd thought, he just might have one stashed for ya, among the debris.. Bad Grin

)

I guess you have to ask yourself - How will I feel coming home to this kind of a mess everyday?
Do I want to do a good half hour/hour of clean-up a day for someone else and possibly their children?
Do I get resentful of such things?

Get a cleaning service. And have designated clean-up times where everyone tidies a specific space in the house. Start this from Day One. Get a chart with duties to rotate. Whatever you need to do.

I dated a man who collected everything - he had a room piled with old playboy (really!), national geographic and Bon Apetit. When I asked him why - he told me he might need the Bon apetit to find a recipe for making something? (HUH?). He had to go.!

On the other hand he may make a killing on ebay selling those Playboy's.

free skin care · Sun May 31, 2009 9:34 am

I agree that it comes down to how I deal with it and how I will cope.

As I have said, I am not a nag and know that I will end up doing it but am worried about getting resentful.

We are going to have a cleaning person to do the cleaning.

He will have his own room to keep papers. Seriously, I would say this is the main thing cluttering his house. He is a professional and must have all of his school stuff, old letter from girlfriends from 30 years ago, legal papers, phone bills from the last 20 years, receipts, etc.

He doesn't collect anything per say, just doesn't throw anything out.

If he didn't have kids (his kids are with him about 30% of the time) I don't think I would be as concerned because I think I could pick up the slack of one additional person but the though of 3 additional people is daunting. I often will cook just eggs for dinner for me and my daughter and we are both happy with that. Feeding 5 is different than just feeding two.

The other option is for me to reduce my work load (which I could do when we are married as I currently work 2 part time jobs which equals full time) to do more around the house. I think overall that would be better for us as a family but am not sure if I would be happy doing that.

free skin care · Sun May 31, 2009 9:58 am

Quote:

He will have his own room to keep papers. Seriously, I would say this is the main thing cluttering his house. He is a professional and must have all of his school stuff, old letter from girlfriends from 30 years ago, legal papers, phone bills from the last 20 years, receipts, etc.

He sounds like a "Hoarder" which is a form of OCD. Tread carefully!!

I get the sense that you are really having doubts about living with this guy and would strongly suggest you follow your instincts.

free skin care · Sun May 31, 2009 9:58 am

This topic is interesting, as my husband and I are natural messies, although I am the only one who fights it in pursuit of a neat environment. I do sympathize with your situation and hope you don't think this is harsh, as it's meant to be constructive: It sounds like you have a lot of insight, but it also sounds like you think you are "right" and he is "wrong," rather than simply different. If so, that would eventually be a source of resentment. You say:

"I naturally do something quickly and efficiently when I see it needs doing..."

"...it is wrong for me to expect a grown man to look after his stuff? It is hard for me to understand it since I think that if you put things back right away where they belong you save time (by not having to clean up later) and keep things neat."

The fact is, he DOES look after his stuff and always has,just not the way you would prefer. Another way to look at the situation, is that you expect a whole house full of people to live in accordance with YOUR standards. Even though you realize that your standards are fairly rigid and irrational, you don't suggest that you might change them at all:

"He is more relaxed than I am, able to do fun things while his house is a mess and not give it a second thought. I cannot and while I intellectually know that going for a walk while the sun is out may be more important than getting the dishes done, I can't relax if they are not done because I know they will be waiting for me when I get back."

And then there is the whole step-kids issue:

"Will having to feed/clean up after his kids build resentment?"[i]

If you expect his messy kid to live in accordance with your standards of neatness, then yes, that's going to be a problem. The kid will probably hate you, for starters. I don't know about the feeding issue. Will he resent feeding your kids? Or spending money on them? Or time?

I could give tips on specific things to do to handle living with messies: For example, I periodically sweep all the clutter belonging to one or another family member into a fold-up mesh basket and deposit it into the clutterer's bedroom for him to deal with; I also pay myself a little extra stipend for doing extra housework, which I then spend on skincare, naturally. However, it seems to me that it would be more helpful for the two of you to go to pre-marital couples counseling to work out your differences in a mutually satisfying way that is specific to the two of you. That might mean both of you have to change a bit. For example, he might agree to put all the counter paperwork out of sight during the week and deal with it on Saturday mornings, while you agree to do the filing and checkbook reconciliation. And you'll probably have to be willing to renegotiate your agreement whenever circumstances change, or if it doesn't work as well as you anticipated. That being said, it doesn't seem like an insurmountable problem, since there is a lot that you appreciate and love about each other. Good luck and best wishes to both of you! HTH

free skin care · Sun May 31, 2009 10:20 am

Anya: I am not sure...don't think he is a "hoarder" rather that he doesn't make time to go through old stuff and get rid of what he doesn't need anymore.

Tessera: You brought up some very good points and gave me lots to think about. Perhaps I was approaching it from an "I am right, he is wrong" point of view. Maybe it's more that he can function in a neat environment as good or better than in a messy one and I feel I can't function in a messy environment.

I am trying to change and by that I mean, leaving a pot in the sink if we want to get a movie started or go for a walk while it is still light out. Part of my "uptightness" stems from being a single mom, working 2 jobs, and keeping a house and yard in order. I had no help and had to do everything on my own the last 5 years have felt a bit like a hamster on a wheel.

His kids really like me and I like them. I don't expect my finance to pay for anything to do with my daughter when we are married, nor do I expect him to feed her although there may be the odd time that he makes a dinner on his own for the kids.

We are in pre-marital counselling and it is helping although we have not gotten into the specifics of running the home yet. I don't want to be insulting and am trying to work this out in my own head before voicing my concerns. I don't want to offend him and even this discussion has been very helpful.

I agree that both of us are going to have to change a bit. With my being so busy and having so much on my plate these last 5 years, I feel that I have no time to take on even one more thing- that is my fear I guess. It's not that I am worried about doing more cooking, cleaning, etc., IF I HAD THE TIME, but I am maxed out right now, totally, to the point where I am not leading a life of balance because of having to make ends meet. I have lots to be grateful for but it has been a rough road for me these last few years. My fear of becoming resentful stems from the fact that I have little to no time to myself right now and the thought of having to take on more in the way of cooking or cleaning scares me in that I might feel so overwhelmed that I lose it.

free skin care · Sun May 31, 2009 1:35 pm

"We are going to hire a house cleaner so I won't need to worry about that part but they don't do dishes or tidy"

RED FLAG RED FLAG RED FLAG

I've tried the housekeeper and it didn't work. Caused so many arguments that I finally had to give it up. Why?
- Hubby and GROWN teenage children wouldn't clean up their floors or the top of their surfaces for the housekeeper to clean, dust, vacuum. Put a laundry basket in each bedroom...didn't work. One son picked it up and put in on his desk chair because he was tired of having it in the way. Clothes still on the floor. Hubby just ignored the laundry basket. Have you any idea how disrespectful it feels to have to pick up a grown mans undies every single day of your life. Especially when it has been discussed again and again and again. They also hated getting ready for the housekeeper and it caused no end of misery.

My Hubby comes from a family of pack rats and he is a pack rat. I toss everything I can get my hands on because I hate clutter.

After 25 years of marriage I can say you can make it work but it will drive you to medication.

free skin care · Sun May 31, 2009 2:12 pm

Lily I'm just concerned that anyone would actually keep useless papers dating back 25 years and apparently hasn't had the time to ditch them Shock

I still maintain there's a deeper seeded reason for not getting rid of that stuff - combined with his housekeeping habits. Does he actually ditch anything, or does he hold on in case it might be "useful" sometime?

He's not going to change any more than you are going to change, so either you accept him the way he is, marry him and be his personal maid or continue on living in separate houses.

I'm more than familiar with a hoarder/slob. My b/f and I have been "together" for the past 20 years. He's a combination of both and for that reason I refuse to live with him. He visits on weekends, leaves his clothes, newspapers on the floor, goes through my garbage and retrieves items that "might come in handy someday" and doesn't clean up after himself at all. If I had that situation 7 days a week, 356 days a year - we wouldn't have lasted 6 months Bad Grin

free skin care · Sun May 31, 2009 2:29 pm

Milbader: Okay, so my finance is a selective slob I think. By that I mean he does not leave clothes lying around at all. He has a pile of laundry in the laundry room in the basket but no where else. I have never ever seen a pair of undies left on the floor or any of his other clothing actually.

Anya: I don't know if he is a hoarder or not. He doesn't seem like it to me as he doesn't seem to keep weird useless stuff around. Some of the boxes of old school stuff/papers were shipped by his parents when they moved from their family home and he stuffed them in his closet and probably just hasn't made time to go through all that stuff yet. And a lot of the stuff lying around is stuff he needs to recylce. The stuff is in boxes waiting to be take to the recycle depot but he never gets around to going (they are only open certain hours).

If I were to be honest I would admit that out in my shed I have boxes full of teaching material that I haven't used in 12 years but am hanging on to it "just in case". I do get rid of old bills though.

His living room is basically tidy except for the box of Christmas ornaments and a board game he started playing with his kids. It's really his office/laundry room/kitchen that are piled with stuff.

I think some of the paper stuff has to do with keeping bills/reciepts for writing off things for work and also things he needs to keep for legal reasons due to his divorce.

"He visits on weekends, leaves his clothes, newspapers on the floor, goes through my garbage and retrieves items that "might come in handy someday" and doesn't clean up after himself at all."

Wow. The going through the garbage part would be funny if it weren't so sad.

I love getting all this feedback- thank you- it is allowing me to see this from different points of view and it is helpful. My fiance has always been respectful when he is here and will suggest that he do the dishes before we do anything else because he knows it is important to me. I have recyle containers that I empty regularly and he always puts things where they belong here. That makes me think he may not be an outright slob- he doesn't drop things all over the place. Perhaps it is more than he needs someone to get an organizational system in place and then he will follow along as long as I keep things in check? I think he let his place get to the stage it is at and now probably is too overwhelmed and busy to start going through it all.

Living in separate houses would actually be okay with me. I am impressed that you have been doing it for 20 years. I know another couple like that and it works really well for them.

free skin care · Sun May 31, 2009 4:18 pm

I agree with another poster that you are approaching it from the belief that you are 'right' and he is not. honestly your fiancee sounds pretty good if you ask me. My husband criticized my every move, but would not lift a finger to help at all.

If you cannot enjoy life until the dishes are done, I would say that represents a deeper issue just as much as his hoarding does. My counselor said we marry someone at our maturity level, so that is something to think about. I also believe you do not 'have' to clean after his kids, it is a choice you make. period. And you can choose not to do it.

Here is what I have done, I started to not clean up after my kids because they are old enough now, (mid elementary) and as a result, I expect them to clean up after themselves. The fact is that my expectations have changed, but they still are not cleaning. So now the stuff I am now getting rid of is their stuff. I gave them many warnings that if they wanted something, they would have to take care of it, and they are not taking care so I am tossing or donating the items. The funny thing is, I think I wanted them to care for their stuff (when they really could care less). So I kept giving them chances to care about stuff they did not care about !! Sounds crazy and it retrospect it is !! I think we all will be happier with a neater environment, I am not going to spend my life cleaning up after people, not my kids or anyone else's. That is my choice.

Also regarding the plates having to be clean issue, how about using paper plates that you throw away after? How about grilling so there is not much mess in the kitchen? How about mimimizing your cooking tasks, like while making scrambled eggs - add milk to the eggs in the skillet you cook in (vs mixing in a seperate bowl first) this saves you one step ! Also eating fresh vegetables that do not require cooking, this is much better for you anyway. I know this sounds crazy, but last year we ordered out our thanksgiving dinner from Meijer !! I never would have done this a few years ago, I was too 'vain' about those types of things back then. I think it cost around $40 for all the fixins for 8 people. It was the most relaxing thanksgiving ever !! I really mean that. In prior years I had so much stress because I thought I 'had' to do this or that. I finally realized I do not 'have' to do any of these things, unless I choose to. And this has made me a much more cheerful giver as a result, vs feeling the resentment.

Anyway, there is more then one way to skin a horse. I would encourage you to give some serious thought that perhaps your 'way' causes YOU stress and generates resentment ? That if you don't get your 'way' you cannot relax and resentment builds. Then that must not be a very emotionally healthy 'way', if you think of it from that perspective. I used to be this 'way' to, not a neat freak but definitely about other issues.

good luck lily !

free skin care · Sun May 31, 2009 4:34 pm

Luvtosmile:
Thanks for that post. Could be deeper issues on my part- I am not ruling that out. I don't remember being like this before being divorced and realizing that EVERTHING was up to me to do (no friends or family where I lived as I moved to get married). It meant that if I didn't do something right away, it would be waiting for me the next day and if I let things get out of control, I didn't have enough spare/free time to catch up. (My ex husband also criticized every move yet didn't lift a finger- my finance is not like that.)

I need to realize that I don't need to be in survival mode anymore. You're right, my finance is a great guy and I think we can learn from each other and meet in the middle. He is not expecting me to clean up after him and doesn't purposely throw stuff all over. It is ME who thinks I will need to do the picking up but perhaps I don't.

I like the concept of choosing not to clean up after the kids. Do you give them warnings before getting rid of their stuff?

free skin care · Sun May 31, 2009 4:37 pm

Luvtosmile - awesome post. Thanks - really - it hit home for me - things to think about and hope it helps Lily.

free skin care · Sun May 31, 2009 5:19 pm

Hi Lily:

I do give my kids warnings. I honestly think they don't care about most of their belongings. Perhaps I am raising insensitive people . . . but I do not think so. I have come to the conclusion that they simply are not materialistic !! And maybe I was somehow trying to make them 'care' about material items ?? Because I am older and therefore much farther removed from 'wholesomeness'? Holy Wonders what a discovery !! I think what they truly want (and complain about) is spending more time with me ! My kids are truly more connected to what is important, then I.

I think in your case, with stepkids, it will be really hard to figure out what the balance is. I think parents use material items, as a substitute for real relationships with their kids (and with each other). You don't want them to hate you, as another poster said. But also if you think you will resent them, then that is definitely a maturity issue on your part Lily.

We all need (deserve) unconditional love. I know the world gives us reasons why we should not love unconditionally but I have come to the conclusion that the world is wrong.

gotta run ! Smile

free skin care · Sun May 31, 2009 5:19 pm

I'm glad you weren't offended by what I said; I do think everyone is trying to help.

"Maybe it's more that he can function in a neat environment as good or better than in a messy one and I feel I can't function in a messy environment."

Yes, he can function in a neat environment, but he can't create and maintain one. Those are different skills. He's not out to make you miserable; he wants you to be happy, but it's just as hard for him to change as it is for you. I recommend the book Living with a Messie by Sandra Felton, which gives practical ideas on how to maintain some order in the home without ruining the relationship.

"I am trying to change and by that I mean, leaving a pot in the sink if we want to get a movie started or go for a walk while it is still light out. Part of my "uptightness" stems from being a single mom, working 2 jobs, and keeping a house and yard in order. I had no help and had to do everything on my own the last 5 years have felt a bit like a hamster on a wheel."

Good for you! Changing is without doubt the hardest thing; I struggle with it daily. I was raised by a single mom and have nothing but admiration for all your hard work. Keep recognizing that YOU are the one who defined what keeping things "in order" meant, and your standards may have been excessively high given your circumstances. (The grass doesn't care whether it is two inches or five.) Can you, your fiance and the kids come to a consensus regarding how the house and yard should be kept and who will do it? Can you give up at least one paid job after marriage, to free up some homemaking time?

"His kids really like me and I like them. I don't expect my finance to pay for anything to do with my daughter when we are married, nor do I expect him to feed her although there may be the odd time that he makes a dinner on his own for the kids."

If you don't want to cook for everyone, make that clear up front. Assuming the kids are old enough to prepare food, they can take turns helping with menu planning and cooking chores, but an adult usually has to get the groceries. However, if you are trying to create a blended family, rather than a roommate situation, you may want to have family dinners. Children need to contribute, but they also need to be nurtured by the adults in their home, no matter who the bio-parents are. Wouldn't your daughter feel good if your fiance made a special little snack for her? I would suggest talking it over with the kids first rather than "surprising" them after the wedding. I totally get that you can't take on one more chore by yourself.

"We are in pre-marital counselling and it is helping although we have not gotten into the specifics of running the home yet. I don't want to be insulting and am trying to work this out in my own head before voicing my concerns. I don't want to offend him and even this discussion has been very helpful."

It sounds like you are doing all the right things. You won't come across as insulting if you explain to your fiance and counselor that you want to learn how to negotiate differences in a positive way, and are not blaming or being superior. Always give your fiance the benefit of the doubt that he is doing the best he can. He sounds like a good guy. There is some evidence that messies are psychologically different than neatniks; our brains appear to function differently. You might even see if help is available for your inability to function in a disordered environment. (Personally, I periodically freak out at clutter and sweep through the house like a tornado. Just one of the many quirks my dh tolerates in a bemused sort of way.)

"My fear of becoming resentful stems from the fact that I have little to no time to myself right now and the thought of having to take on more in the way of cooking or cleaning scares me in that I might feel so overwhelmed that I lose it. Smile

This is exactly how you need to present the issue to the counselor. You and your fiance are on the same team. Together, the three of you should be able to come up with a plan to take some of the load off your shoulders. No one was meant to do it all and husbands can be really great that way. (Mine is presently out building a fence around the yard so I don't have to watch the dog every minute he is outside.) You MUST have some time to yourself before you go STARK, STARING MAD!

Hang in there! Things will get better. Now I have to go figure out what's for dinner... Very Happy

free skin care · Sun May 31, 2009 5:23 pm

Luvtosmile: I didn't mean I would resent the kids- they are after all only kids and I was not neat as a kid. I meant I would resent my fiance.

How sweet that your kids want more time with you! Perhaps our kids today have so much stuff and what they really want is our time. Wise words and it'll save us money.

free skin care · Sun May 31, 2009 6:21 pm

WOW thanks sister sweets, you made my day. Smile

Truly you did and I am thankful this gave you something to think about. How wonderful !!

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