Any tips for arthritis?
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free skin care · Sat Nov 21, 2009 5:51 pm

I have just been diagnosed with arthritis in both of my knees. I cannot use aspirin or aspirin containing products. Has anyone found anything that has helped arthritis pain?

free skin care · Sat Nov 21, 2009 7:37 pm

Ginger has studies done on it for it's anti-inflammatory qualities... the specific study I remember reading had to do with those that have RA (I think this is considered the worst form or arthritis as it's also quite deforming), and that daily ingestion of ginger 'caused for a marked decrease in pain relievers...

Sorry to hear about Arthritis. I had it identified in a neck x-ray. So far not unbearable... but it's a bit worrisome!

My favorite Ginger "drink" = 1 small beet, 1/2 lemon, and 1 1/2" chunk of ginger. Serve over Ice.. although It might be good warm like tea (sweeten as you find necessary...) You need to run this through a juicer!

Best wishes!

free skin care · Sat Nov 21, 2009 8:04 pm

Riley are you taking supplements?
MSM, Fish oils and Glucosamine are supposed to be really good for arthritis.
I shattered my wrist in a motorcycle accident 18 years ago. I started taking the fish oil and MSM a few years ago as I started to worry about hitting 40 and the possiblilty of getting arthritis in my wrist. So far no arthritis.
I hope you're not going through too much pain.

free skin care · Sat Nov 21, 2009 9:30 pm

Thanks so much for the tips, Claudia and Mishey. I am not taking any supplements right now. My doc says no fish oil for me (affects my platelets). I'll check to see if Glucosamine will alter them or not, as well as the ginger. That is my biggest issue - what I can take that won't drop my platelets.

Sat Nov 21, 2009 9:47 pm

I'm only 29 but have genetic osteoarthritis in my knees. They reconstructed my patella to try and get me a few more years (hopefully 15) before I need replacements. My cartlidge is like chalk and is disintegrating away so I am mostly bone on bone now.

I am a very keen snowboarder and have 3 children so didn't want to end up in a wheelchair like my grandfather or unable to do any sports or exercise like my Mum. I went to the best Orthopedic surgeon in Australia and with his help and some amazing physios and trainers I have managed to build the muscle up in my legs and butt to the point where i have NO knee pain anymore. My knees are like those of an 80 year old with severe arthritis so it really is amazing - they use me as proof of what exercise can do for severe arthritis. It is proof that if the muscle is there the knee joint itself doesn't have to carry the load or do all the work - the muscles take the load. If I go 1 week without exercising the pain begins to return so it's dedication but so worth it for the quality of life!!

My surgeon said so many people suffer severe pain with half the damage I have but refuse to help themselves by building muscle - depends if you would prefer the pain or the inconvenience of exercise. If you buy yourself an exercise bike now and start with 20 minutes a day and then progress to a good gym and start some pretty full on weight training for your legs I can guarantee you can stop the pain - hard work though but so so worth it!! It hurts to start with as your knee has to cope because the muscle isn't there yet but as that muscle builds the pain get's less and less. I have my life back again!!

free skin care · Sat Nov 21, 2009 9:52 pm

Rileygirl,

I, unfortunately, am very familiar with knee osteoarthritis (broke a meniscus, had a surgery and arthritis after it).

In terms of medications there is a whole set of non-steroid anti-inflammatory medications such as Celebrex, but that you should discuss with your physician, since they all have contra indications and may not be warranted in your condition.

There is also something called "Joint Lube" (you can get it on Amazon) - which several people had recommended to me, you can also check that out.

You also have to exercise (but be careful not to aggravate the knees), you might want to get a referral for Phys. Therapy and get the PT to show you what and how you can do.

Also, people claim that raw food diet seems to cure it, but I have not tried it yet, so have no personal experience.

I am still looking for a solution (I take fish oil for almost 5 years and it does not do a thing for my arthritis), I am planning to try MSM and am trying Joint Lube, but it is too early to say.

HTH

free skin care · Sat Nov 21, 2009 10:04 pm

Sunlit,

what an inspiring story.

I am so happy for you and admire your dedication.

I was also told that bike is most critical (and losing all the extra weight), as well as building muscles.

I was told not to exercise in acute phase (when you can not walk, and they have to inject the knees to bring inflammation down), but to start as soon as things get a bit better.

Could you, please, tell me more about "patella reconstruction" surgery?

TIA

free skin care · Sat Nov 21, 2009 10:54 pm

Thank you, sunlit and sigma. What an inspiring story, sunlit!

I do exercise and am trying to build back up again. I definitely need to drop extra weight, as I know that does not help the situation. Is the bike really necessary? That was one of the things that really hurt my knees! Full lunges kill my knees, as well. I can only do partial reps for them.

Sigma, the Joint Lube sounds interesting and I will check it out.

free skin care · Sat Nov 21, 2009 11:19 pm

Rileygirl,

I believe that lunges should not be done by people with knee problems at all.

Bike also should be adjusted to certain length, so it would not hurt your knees. Most likely it is not set up properly if it hurts you (the seat is too close to the pedals)

I believe you have to discuss all your exercises with your orthopedist or PT to make sure you would not do anything that is not good for your knees (I did that, so am speaking from experience).

HTH

free skin care · Sun Nov 22, 2009 12:28 am

Riley,
So sorry about the diagnoses! I know after talks with a few chiropractors over the years all the sports and ballet horseback riding I did as a kid and teen also gymnastics for countless years. Then four pregnancies with large babies I did my back, knees and hips in!
There are electric current and hydro therapies they use that are tremendous help!
I also have a blend I would be more than happy to pm to you if you want to try, it works really for me and others I have made it for! I actually could make some up and send it off to you!
This is just a topical mixture that relieved the pain, not replacing above recommendations. Just in addition to for relief, I can't take many meds either for my own medical issues.
Just let me know!

DM

Sun Nov 22, 2009 1:13 am

I call it a patella reconstruction but it never had a name to my knowledge. They cut some of ligaments and shaved and resurfaced all the damaged areas of bone and the patella itself and then they realigned the patella so that the bone was rubbing against different areas. In effect I had worn away part of my bone and patella so they realligned everything so a new area could get worn away. Hopefully this doesn't happen too quick or I'll be having knee replacements way too young and end up with a host of issues. it was simply a procedure to buy me time. If I was older they would have replaced the joint but that isn't an option at my age or an option for my lifestyle.

I have done lots of research and my surgeon is at the forefront of orthopedics. He is the surgeon to many olympic athletes and in charge of many studies internationally. If you have no muscle in your legs no matter what you do you will get pain - it's a given. Your knee joint will have to take the full force of your weight and motions - this will hurt. The only thing that will take this pain away is to build the muscle and this will be impossible without initial pain in the knee - as the muscle is gone (mine had wasted away). I exercised with tears on many occasions and had many nights covered in ice and wondering if it could ever get better. A year down the track and I am doing huge jumps on my snowboard and beating my kids in tag. I have seen many people with alot less damage than me unable to even stand up without using their hands to boost them.

My surgeon told me most people and physios will use the - if it hurts I better stop theory - and they will never be able to build muscle to a point where it can relieve pain. It is essential to exercise with guidance from an orthopedic surgeon/ physio - who is educated - the old school ones will tell you not to exercise past pain The newer specialists involved in studies and athletes will tell you different.

Some things are off limits - for me I am never allowed to run due to the repitive wear this has on the joint Sad

I really encourage anyone with arthritis to look up a good orthopedic surgeon and work hard!! I watched my grandfather hobble from the day I was born and eventually die on the operating table from a heart attack having his 13th knee surgery - he never believed in exercise because it hurt. It's a horrid disease but one you CAN have some control over!!

free skin care · Sun Nov 22, 2009 5:23 am

Wow... Sunlit... INSANE! Way to go!

Muscle support around the knee is an absolute must. I can't imagine even functioning without it.

Would you say the pain of working through it is more associated with the ACTUAL arthritis?

I can see working through that. But I have a hard time wrapping my mind around working through a joint pain if you DON'T have arthritis. That seems like the warning that says... "keep doing this and you will pay"... That said, however, there are generally SEVERAL options to strengthen the muscles around the knees, sans arthritis, without enduring joint pain... for those of us still on that side of the fence.

I dislike lunges... main reason... I don't feel stable in my knee in picking up my foot, and lunging forward... HOWEVER, I substitute by sliding the back leg backwards... The front, "lunged" knee is supported by a very stable foot position... and I can get the whole set of muscles engaged.

Then of course, squats of all varieties, important to work those hams and calves as well...and I also think a good stretching program to keep the muscles nice and supple.

Other supplements that come to mind: Glucosamine, MSM...

Best...

free skin care · Sun Nov 22, 2009 7:49 am

ClaudiaFE wrote:

But I have a hard time wrapping my mind around working through a joint pain if you DON'T have arthritis. That seems like the warning that says... "keep doing this and you will pay"...

I agree. I think this is exactly what happened to me. I was trying to lose weight and decided to try jogging. I started slow walk/jog, but then one day I felt really good and I decided to jog the entire way (even though it hurt). I could not move the next day. I just figured I had injured my knee, but I believe this hastened the arthritis for me.

My doc is the kind you are talking about sunlit; if it hurts, don't do it. I think I will need to see a specialist after some more lab and x-rays. They are trying to rule-out rheumatoid arthritis, which I am really hoping I don't have.

Darkmoon, yes, I am interested in your recipe for the joint pain! Send me a PM with the ingredients so I can whip something up! Laughing

free skin care · Sun Nov 22, 2009 8:04 am

DarkMoon,

if you could share your recipe for arthritis I would also greatly appreciate it too (either here or via PM).TIA.

There are many treatment modalities that Phys. Therapist can do: electro, magnetic, ultra-sound, heat, etc. For the knees I have never heard about hydro, besides exercise in water, but everything is possible.

There are also "water cures" in Europe - in Hungary, Slovakia, Germany -when you sit in the water, derived from natural hot springs, and it does work if there are no contra indications. Also it is not cheap now days.

There is also a "Miracle" lake in Florida, which also has similar qualities - people just walk in there for a few hours a day.

Also, in "acute" phase heat will aggravate the condition, but ice would be quite helpful. Once the acute phase is over, you can do warm bath (with sea salt) - might be of help.

The key though is exercise and building muscle to take some of the workload off the knees - that is what I was told be every physician here and in Europe that I had seen.

BTW - running, Stairmaster, lounges are not recommended for people with knee problems.

HTH

Sun Nov 22, 2009 8:33 am

Celadrin (CFA) cream has shown an ability to combat inflammation, reduce pain and effect positive improvements in performance for those with arthritis. I think it is also available as an oral supplement. Here are a few excerpts regarding it from Pub Med that might be helpful:

-------
A Cetylated Fatty Acid Topical Cream with Menthol Reduces Pain and Improves Functional Performance in Individuals With Arthritis.

This investigation was an extension of a previous study conducted in our laboratory in which we showed that 1 month of treatment with a topical cream (Celadrin) consisting of cetylated fatty acids was effective for reducing pain and improving functional performance in individuals with osteoarthritis (OA) of the knee (Kraemer et al., Journal of Rheumatology, 2004). We wanted to verify that the addition of menthol to the compound would produce a similar percentage of improvement in therapeutic effects. We used a single treatment group with a pre-post experimental design to examine % treatment changes. Individuals diagnosed with OA of the knee (N = 10; age, 66.4 +/- 11.5 years) and severe pain (e.g., OA, rheumatoid arthritis) of the elbow (N = 8; age, 59.1 +/- 18.2 years) and wrist (N = 10; age, 60.3 +/- 16.8 years) were tested for pain and functional performance before and after 1 week of treatment with a topical cream consisting of cetylated fatty acids and menthol applied twice per day. In individuals with knee OA, significant improvements in stair-climbing ability (about 12%), "up-and-go" performance (about 12%), balance and strength (about 16.5%), and range of motion (about 3.5%) were observed, as were reductions in pain. In individuals with severe pain of the elbow and wrist, significant improvements in dynamic (about 22 and 24.5%, respectively) and isometric (about 33 and 42%, respectively) local muscular endurance were observed, as was a reduction in pain. Neither group demonstrated significant changes in maximal grip strength or maximal force production. One week of treatment with a topical cream consisting of cetylated fatty acids and menthol was similarly effective for reducing pain and improving functional performance in individuals with arthritis of the knee, elbow, and wrist. The % changes were consistent with our prior work on the compound without menthol. Further work is needed to determine the impact of menthol in such a cream. Nevertheless, our data support the use of a topical cream consisting of cetylated fatty acids (with or without menthol) for enhancing the potential for exercise training in this population.

PMID: 15903393

-------
Cetylated Fatty Acids Improve Knee Function In Patients with Osteoarthritis

OBJECTIVE: To determine the benefit of cetylated fatty acids (CFA) on knee range of motion and function in patients with osteoarthritis (OA).

METHODS: Sixty-four patients with chronic knee OA were evaluated at baseline and at 30 and 68 days after consuming either placebo (vegetable oil; n = 31) or CFA (Celadrin; n = 33). Evaluations included physician assessment, knee range of motion with goniometry, and the Lequesne Algofunctional Index (LAI).

RESULTS: After 68 days, patients treated with CFA exhibited significant (p < 0.001) increase in knee flexion (10.1 degrees) compared to patients given placebo (1.1 degrees). Neither group reported improvement in knee extension. Patient responses to the LAI indicated a significant (p < 0.001) shift towards functional improvement for the CFA group (-5.4 points) after 68 days compared to a modest improvement in the placebo group (-2.1 points).

CONCLUSION: Compared to placebo, CFA provides an improvement in knee range of motion and overall function in patients with OA of the knee. CFA may be an alternative to the use of nonsteroidal antiinflammatory drugs for the treatment of OA.

PMID: 12180734

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Effects Of Treatment with a Cetylated Fatty Acid Topical Cream on Static Postural Stability and Plantar Pressure Distribution in Patients with Knee Osteoarthritis.

The purpose of the present investigation was to examine the effects of 30 days of treatment with a topical cream consisting of cetylated fatty acids on static postural stability and plantar pressures in patients with osteoarthritis (OA) of one or both knees. Forty patients diagnosed with knee OA were randomly assigned to 1 of 2 topical treatment groups: (a) cetylated fatty acid (CFA; N = 20; age = 62.7 +/- 11.7 years); or (b) placebo (P; N = 20; age = 64.6 +/- 10.5 years). Patients were tested on 2 occasions: (a) baseline (T1), and (b) following a 30-day treatment period consisting of cream application twice per day (T2). Assessments included 20- and 40-second quiet standing protocols on a force plate to measure center of pressure (COP) total excursion length, COP velocity, and rearfoot and forefoot plantar pressure distribution. In the CFA group, a significant reduction in the COP excursion length and velocity were observed at T2, whereas no significant differences were observed in the P group. No significant differences in mean forefoot, rearfoot, or rearfoot-to-forefoot plantar pressure ratios were observed in either group at T2. However, in a subgroup of participants designated to be right- or left-side dominant, improvements in the right-to-left forefoot plantar pressure ratios were observed in both groups. These data indicate that 30 days of treatment with a topical cream consisting of cetylated fatty acids improves static postural stability in patients with knee OA presumably due to pain relief during quiet standing. Such over-the-counter treatment may help improve the exercise trainability of people with OA.

PMID: 15705022

-------
Effect of a cetylated fatty acid topical cream on functional mobility and quality of life of patients with osteoarthritis.

OBJECTIVE: To examine the effect of a topical cream consisting of cetylated fatty acids on functional performance in patients diagnosed with osteoarthritis (OA) of one or both knees.

METHODS: Forty patients diagnosed with knee OA were randomly assigned to one of 2 topical treatment groups: (1) cetylated fatty acid (CFA) (n = 20; age 62.7 +/- 11.7 yrs); or (2) placebo group (n = 20; age 64.6 +/- 10.5 yrs). Patients were tested on 3 occasions: (1) baseline (T1), (2) 30 min after initial treatment (T2), and (3) after 30-day treatment of cream application twice per day (T3). Assessments included knee range of motion (ROM), timed "up-and-go" from a chair and stair climbing, medial step-down test, and the unilateral anterior reach.

RESULTS: For stair climbing ability and the up-and-go test, significant decreases in time were observed at T2 and T3 compared to T1 in the CFA group only. These differences were significant between groups. Supine ROM of the knees increased at T2 and T3 in CFA group, whereas no difference was observed in the placebo group. For the medial step-down test, significant improvement was observed at T2 and T3 compared to T1 in CFA group. For the unilateral anterior reach, significant improvement was observed for both legs in CFA group and in only the left leg in the placebo group. However, the improvements observed in CFA group were significantly greater than placebo group for both legs.

CONCLUSION: Use of a CFA topical cream is an effective treatment for improving knee ROM, ability to ascend/descend stairs, ability to rise from sitting, walk and sit down, and unilateral balance.

PMID: 15088305

Sun Nov 22, 2009 9:07 am

You might also want to consider adding bromelain and serrapeptase such as is found in products like Zymactive Proteolytic Enzymes with Serrapeptase (proteolytic enzyme therapy) to fight inflammation and reduce pain. My MIL takes in between meals with great success for her arthritis. It supposedly is as effective as ibuprofen without any of the side effects. Some of the comments on iHerb for this product might be worth looking at:

http://www.iherb.com/Natural-Factors-Double-Strength-Zymactive-90-Tablets/2638?at=0

free skin care · Sun Nov 22, 2009 9:35 am

Havana,

thank you for excellent tips.

I have tried Bromelain by itself and it did not help, but the combination may be the key.

I also have heard from several people about Wobenzyme being very helpful.

HTH

free skin care · Sun Nov 22, 2009 10:07 am

Thanks so much for all the info, Havana and Sigma! I will definitely check into the Zymactive. Sounds like something I can take! The Celadrin looks really good, as well!

free skin care · Sun Nov 22, 2009 10:41 am

I'm very sorry to hear about your diagnosis, rileygirl. It can come as quite a blow at first, but you do come to terms with it and learn how to cope and, hopefully, listen to your body so you can help yourself.

And what an inspiration you are, Sunlit!

Rileygirl - I, too, cannot tolerate aspirin as I have a sensitivity to that and NSAID's (which exacerbate my asthma). It's really frustrating that the usual treatments are proscribed for people like us. Still, I've read some great suggestions for things to try in this thread.

If you are desperate, you may find that a slow release version of a NSAID might be okay for you. I cannot function for too long without NSAID's and, luckily, can tolerate Diclofenac 75mg SR - although I have to take a stomach protector at the same time (Lansoprazole).

I second Sunlit's building up of muscles. Pilates and resistance exercises have helped me greatly. Swimming's generally good, but you have to be careful when your knees are affected - no breast stroke, for instance, as the leg movements can be agonising.

Acupuncture was another thing that really helped me to cope with the pain and stiffness of my arthritis.

Despite my AS and peripheral arthritis in almost every joint, I gradually got my condition under control and strengthened myself, so it is possible. Whilst I'm not as adventurous as Sunlit with her snowboarding, I love to hike and canoe. I'm actually fitter now than many people who are almost half my age! It's all a question of building yourself up (not too fast as you don't want to cause any damage or set yourself back), and getting to know how far you can push yourself - listening to your body and becoming familiar with how it feels.

Good luck!

free skin care · Sun Nov 22, 2009 11:56 am

Thanks so much, majorb. That is very encouraging to hear you are in better shape now! I appreciate the words of encouragement. I was stunned to find out I have this. I'm only 46! I thought this happened to much older people only and was really surprised to read about you all that have arthritis, as well. I am very thankful to all of you who have written in with suggestions. I have a lot of reading to do now!

free skin care · Sun Nov 22, 2009 12:45 pm

Ladies - good luck and best of health to all!

There are so many interesting and new things to research and try.

I also have heard about acupuncture, and know some people it had helped. I tried it and it did not work for my knees, but everyone is different.

Rileygirl, it is definitely worth trying. Please, let us know how you are doing.

Good luck to all!

free skin care · Sun Nov 22, 2009 2:53 pm

RileyGirl... I have a feeling that arthritis is present for a while before it becomes painful with consistency... I'm 38, and the x-ray that I had of my neck ('cause it was just constantly hurting) was done I think around age 32 or 33... and I was told they could "see" the arthritis... now I have no idea what that actually looks like... but it's insane to hear that when you're young... I agree... My father who is in his 60's has bad arthritis in his neck... he just always hurts and is always taking meds... would like to get him on some of the alternative options... hopefully reducing the meds.... I get worried that those just accumulate in your liver... Ugg... Does is ever end???

free skin care · Sun Nov 22, 2009 2:55 pm

ClaudiaFE wrote:

Ugg... Does is ever end???

Probably not! I think it sucks to get old! Laughing

(I agree with you about the meds. I worry about the liver issue, as well.)

free skin care · Sun Nov 22, 2009 4:21 pm

ClaudiaFE wrote:

RileyGirl... I have a feeling that arthritis is present for a while before it becomes painful with consistency... I'm 38, and the x-ray that I had of my neck ('cause it was just constantly hurting) was done I think around age 32 or 33... and I was told they could "see" the arthritis... now I have no idea what that actually looks like... but it's insane to hear that when you're young... I agree... My father who is in his 60's has bad arthritis in his neck... he just always hurts and is always taking meds... would like to get him on some of the alternative options... hopefully reducing the meds.... I get worried that those just accumulate in your liver... Ugg... Does is ever end???

Yes, it's a shock to find you have arthritis when you're young. I was finally diagnosed when I was 24 (after about a couple years of severe problems with it), and it made me feel so down when I saw frail-looking, elderly people who were able to walk better than I could (I could scarcely make it half-way across a small room). But then I used to think about the very young children who have it. At least I had over 20 years with no arthritis - what those young kids go through breaks my heart.

At first, you'll probably go through a denial stage, then an angry stage, etc - same kind of thing you experience with grief. Hang on in there because you do get through it. The main thought that helped me was that other people cope with it - and if they can, then so can I.

Also, focus on helping yourself to get stronger. It gives you a goal to work towards. When you have to give things up (I loved running so much), find other things to take their place (for me, it was learning to swim when I was strong enough to try it after a few years). In fact, I've done lots of things now that I'd never even thought of trying before I got arthritis!

Don't let yourself get too down, and remember that you can always come on here and vent your feelings or have a virtual shoulder to lean on.

Sun Nov 22, 2009 5:33 pm

Claudia, Yes, my pain was from the arthritis when I exercised. The arthritis is very advanced and after 6 months of resting and protecting my knees and then after the surgery I had no muscle. I got lots of compliments on my skinny thighs though Shock

Amazing what people think is attractive!!

In a normal body, pain is a sign something is wrong - stop and go to a doctor, but in my case we knew exactly where the pain was coming from, why it was there and that the pain was necessary to work through to build the much needed muscle. I need more muscle than the average person to mimimize the weight taken by my knees. As soon as I stop and the muscle begins to waste the pain starts to return. it's going to depend on your own body what your specialist recommends though.....you may also need to be slightly crazy to put yourself through what I put myself through!! Worth it when I clean the boys up on the mountain snowbaording though... Laughing

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