Autoimmune disease response "dilute" botox?
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free skin care · Thu Jul 18, 2013 12:21 pm

I have Hashimoto's and Sjogren's diseases. My first botox treatment lasted five months. The next a little less. The following two with Dysport weren't as good. I use it for crow's feet but last time I added in the frown lines because it was free. It did absolutely nothing. I made my frown worse I think because for the following week or two I kept frowning and deepened the lines.

There are four kinds of botox on the market. Would the other two be any better or worse?
http://fauquierent.blogspot.com/2010/10/there-are-four-different-types-of-botox.html

Or is my dermatologist at fault? She teaches dermatology at a medical school so should know what she is doing.

free skin care · Thu Jul 18, 2013 12:53 pm

I've just done some reading on realself.com, the plastic surgery website. Looks like xeomin might be my next step. Supposed to be cheaper,too. It's funny how so many women claim to have become immune to botox and dysport and the doctors dismiss them, saying it's not possible unless it's been years of use. Obviously they are wrong!

free skin care · Thu Jul 18, 2013 1:18 pm

There is an article on this in the Daily Mail today, about women either immune or becoming immune over time - sorry can't do links!

free skin care · Thu Jul 18, 2013 1:56 pm

It comes down to two things...1) the injector, and 2) the product.

After trying Botox with 3 different injectors, I can definitely say that I am resistant to the product and need to try another one.

But if you have had issues with 2 different products with the same injector, I would try a new injector. Pick one that is a Platinum Botox reseller and is also part of the Botox education group...you can find that info on their website.

free skin care · Thu Jul 18, 2013 2:37 pm

Found this on the realself.com website:

Allergan has an incentive program for Botox Cosmetic and other aesthetic product sales that has sales "goals" with associated landmark achievement designations. There is no correlation with volume of product sold and quality of injector. That is a misconception.

free skin care · Thu Jul 18, 2013 2:59 pm

SoftSkin wrote:

Found this on the realself.com website:

Allergan has an incentive program for Botox Cosmetic and other aesthetic product sales that has sales "goals" with associated landmark achievement designations. There is no correlation with volume of product sold and quality of injector. That is a misconception.

Do you have a link to that?

The more they sell, the more experienced they are in injections. And they can't be a Botox educator unless they have done a LOT of injecting. After going through 2 injectors, I applied that criteria myself and found that the Platinum level seller who was also a Botox educator seemed to know much more than the other 2, even though they were also very highly recommended.

But if you have a better plan to find a qualified injector, I would love to hear it!

free skin care · Thu Jul 18, 2013 7:15 pm

One thing you will never know is if your injector mixes the neurotoxin correctly. How much saline is added and is it too much or the right level?

You just need to trust your injector. Lots of places mix the solutions too weak to save money.

free skin care · Thu Jul 18, 2013 9:14 pm

I called one derm's office to ask their price. All forms of botox were $12 per unit. Then I called my own derm's office and was told she charged $15. I asked how many units I'd had on my last visit in March and was told 45. I only paid $195 -- three injections on the crow's feet of each eye and one injection on the lid below the pupil. She has always done it that way but this time she added my frown lines but I think it was only three injections there. Does that sound like it was 45 units? But then the price was off. I am discovering that doctors seem to be hiring idiots these days.

free skin care · Fri Jul 19, 2013 7:36 am

Normally I pay 12.00 a unit and the last couple of times I felt like it didn't last as long in my glabellar region (11's). So it would be around 240.00 for just that area and no where else. I have not been in over a year and a half at least.
I went to a botox party last night at my hair salon and paid 8.00 a unit. She was a platinum injector who used to work at the medspa I had been going to since 2004 so I did trust her.
I had 20 units in my 11's, 5 on my forehead for a little lift/softening of the lines and 6 on my lower chin to give a "lift" to the comers of my lips. So 248.00 total for 31 units which I thought was a bargain if it did take.
I am waiting to see.
The hubby has a VERY strong glabellar muscle and he had it done a while ago and it worked the very first time, normal amount of units. The he went back a couple of years later before our sons wedding and the next time it did not. Our doc (who had always injected it) said that the muscle was so strong it would take more. He put in more (more money) and it never did take. The hubby get frustrated and now won't go back.
So it is very interesting how that varies and about the theory about the autoimmune so I am curious.
If the botox doesn't take well this time I might think about the Xeomin. I am not sure about the dysport though just because I have had a lot of friends that it did not work on. Since I have been a botox user since 2004 (but not on a heavy-use basis, just here and there) I wonder if I am considered long-term?
We shall see!

free skin care · Fri Jul 19, 2013 12:25 pm

One derm has a nurse who does cosmetic injections on Saturdays so at least that will be convenient. I think I'll try it once there for the crow's feet with xeomin, if they have it. If not, maybe botox again since I haven't had it in over a year.

I don't care as much about frown lines because I wear bangs and I also color in the line with white pencil with concealer on top and dab of powder. Not as noticeable. Filler would be an option for the future if it bothers me since I get filler in nasolabial folds. I could always have them put a bit in brow area. Unfortunately makeup cannot hide crow's feet. In photos, it's the crow's feet that are more noticeable.

free skin care · Fri Jul 19, 2013 5:33 pm

SoftSkin wrote:

I called one derm's office to ask their price. All forms of botox were $12 per unit. Then I called my own derm's office and was told she charged $15. I asked how many units I'd had on my last visit in March and was told 45. I only paid $195 -- three injections on the crow's feet of each eye and one injection on the lid below the pupil. She has always done it that way but this time she added my frown lines but I think it was only three injections there. Does that sound like it was 45 units? But then the price was off. I am discovering that doctors seem to be hiring idiots these days.

45 units sounds more like Dysport. It costs less per unit but they have to use more.
When you ask about the price of injections - ask about the price of neurotoxins. Then you can find out the price of Xeomin, Botox and Dysport. Botox and Xeomin are usually the same price and get injected at the same unit amounts. Although lots of places are running specials on the Xeomin because it is new.

free skin care · Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:23 am

My friend in her mid 40's did Botox for the first time and had a lot injected yet she didn't feel like she noticed anything. She went to another derm who did a touch up and then she noticed a result. I think it really depends where you go. If you see a place charging $8/unit, be very wary since they are probably diluting or getting cheap products from over sea's and pretending its Botox. If you call an office and they are expensive, most likely you'll get great results and won't need as many units.

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